The Melanie Avalon Biohacking Podcast Episode #299 - Grace Valentine

TRANSCRIPT

(Note: This is generated by AI with 98% accuracy. However, any errors may cause unintended changes in meaning.)

Grace Valentine

I went to bed that night after my first session and I was scared to die. For the first time in my life, I was afraid to die.  The world and humanity and civilization should not focus around work and our value should not be attached to our work. I don't really like the praise I've gotten for being the standard, because I'm not healthy. I'm not a role model for that. I'm really not big on the whole social media thing actually. I will have moments where I'll completely deactivate my Instagram. Like, you can't even find my account. That's the healthiest thing for me.  Welcome.

Melanie Avalon

to the Melanie Avalon biohacking podcast, where we meet the world's top experts to explore the secrets of health, mindset, longevity, and so much more. Are you ready to take charge of your existence and biohack your life? This show is for you. Please keep in mind, we're not dispensing medical advice and are not responsible for any outcomes you may experience from implementing the tactics lying herein.  So friends, are you ready to join me? Let's do this. Welcome back to the Melanie Avalon biohacking podcast. Friends, it was such an honor to sit down today with Grace Valentine. Their story is so, so incredible and inspiring. I've never talked with a top supermodel and Grace knows all about that world. We talk about so, so much in today's episode, including what it's like to be one of the world's top supermodels. We talk about the role of childhood trauma, the evolution of the ego, identity, and self-worth, the role of work versus purpose, and something I am so excited to talk about, which is the role of ketamine and how it radically changed Grace's life.  You'll learn how to be confident, how to deal with beauty standards, some pretty cool travel hacks, and so much more. Also a quick note I want to make. I is Grace's stepfather. So in the beginning, when Grace is talking about their father, that is not Gordy. I thought this episode was so, so powerful and I can't wait to hear what you guys think. The show notes for today's episode will be at Melanie Avalon.com slash Grace Valentine. Those show notes will have a full transcript as well as links to everything that we talked about. So definitely check that out. There will be two episode giveaways for this episode. One will be in my Facebook group. I have biohackers, intermittent fasting plus the real foods plus life. Comment something you learned or something that resonated with you on the pinned post to enter to win something that I love. All right. I think that's all the things. Without further ado, please enjoy this fabulous conversation with Grace Valentine. Hi friends. Welcome back to the show. I am so incredibly excited about the conversation I am about to have. So the backstory on today's conversation, you guys know that I make my Avalon X line and love those supplements so much. And somebody I work with, his name is Gordy through MD logic. He's a key part in making all of that happen. And he and I are actually also currently creating a coffee line, which by the time this comes out, it, I don't know, it might be out. That would be really exciting. Either way, randomly one day Gordy was telling me that he had this incredible daughter who just so happens to be like one of the world's top models, which a that is just like really cool all on its own. And then B he told me that they have gone through their own personal health journey that it had been like, well, we'll hear about it today, but, uh, you know, a really long journey. And then when they started using actually Academy therapy, that they were seeing profound changes there.

Melanie Avalon

So I wanted to do a call. Their name is Grace Valentine. I did a call with Grace and honestly was well, a blown away by what Grace does with their modeling career and everything they do with travel and runways and sleep and just the work. It's honestly insane.  And then on top of that, they told me about their journey with mental health and wellness. And it was, well, a haunting, inspiring. I think listeners are going to get a lot out of this. So Grace, thank you so much for being here. Yeah, thank you for having me. So to start things off, Grace, usually the first question I ask on this show is what is your personal story? But that's pretty much going to be the entirety of this episode. So instead I will start with, cause we talked on the phone. You never, like, did you ever anticipate being a top runway model like you are today?

Grace Valentine

not at all. My career happened very unexpectedly. It's weird because both of my parents modeled and I would have my mom in my ear when I was growing up like, oh, like, practice your posing in front of the mirror, like just in case you're like, you know, over in Europe one day and you like you want to know what to do. Mom, shut up, like you sound crazy.  And then I went through a abrupt breakup when I was 19 while I was living in Pittsburgh. And my mom took me to New York to kind of get my mind off of that. And it was also the pride parade in New York as well. So we came for that. I don't know, it's maybe my third or fourth day. While I was here in New York, we were walking around Times Square. And I was approached by a scouting agent to, to model he asked me if I was interested or if I ever considered it. Yeah, I was kind of just like, yeah, whatever, like, I'll see what it's about. But, you know, anything happened. So I went to the agency the next day, they signed me basically right away. And I never went back to Pittsburgh. After that, they didn't even let me go get my clothes. My mom drove back to Pittsburgh packed about and came back up with it. Yeah, I immediately started working and doing test shoots my first month just building my portfolio and, you know, getting comfortable with the camera. And after that, I yeah, I immediately started working with Vogue and, and Louis Vuitton. And it was, you know, flying to Europe, it was really crazy how it happened so quickly.

Melanie Avalon

That is so crazy to me. It's the stereotypical discovery story. I'm super curious.  Your friends and modeling, is that common to be scouted and that's how it starts? It's probably about 50-50. And then when people, okay, because you said your mom whispering in your ear about posing and stuff like that, but in that 50% that gets scouted, do they normally, like the modeling skills, do you feel like it's something that, like it's a talent people are born with? Do you think anybody can learn it? I'm just curious how that felt for you.

Grace Valentine

Yeah, no, it's such a strange thing to me, like, just if it is a talent or not, because I don't know, like my own personal views on like image and things like that, but only like recently, I would say within the last year or two, I feel like I'm fully, fully comfortable in front of the camera now. So if people are born with that, I'm a bit jealous and happy for them.  But yeah, it took me a minute to kind of be comfortable with myself, let alone like having all these eyes on me, but I still do my work. It's so interesting.

Melanie Avalon

interesting to me. I used to be obsessed growing up. I forgot about this.  I used to watch America's Next Top Model. I have no idea how that compares to the real life modeling, but I would like watch the marathons like all the episodes. When you sign, did you, because you mentioned like all the brands you started working with, was that runway? Was it like catalog photo shoots? What type of work were you doing and do you do?

Grace Valentine

So my first two jobs were photo shoots. I think the first one was for, I think it was either Nordstrom's or Saxpethav. And then my second and third shoot were for Vogue. I got to shoot Vogue magazine with my twin brother. They did like a family story and they flew my brother up from Pittsburgh like really last minute. And that was really cool to do, especially for like my second job.  And then my third job was for Vogue again. It was like an article about like a model, a model's first fashion week, like preparation and what that would look like. And then my fourth job was runway for Louis Vuitton. Whoa.

Melanie Avalon

It's insane. That's so cool that you got all that personal stuff. Is that common in the industry? Not.

Grace Valentine

really actually I think yeah since then I've only had maybe like two two or three personal yeah like kind of more intimate projects since then

Melanie Avalon

That's so so cool. I did see so when you google you one of the top things that comes up is a moment where you Took your shoes off in the middle of Was it fendi?

Grace Valentine

Yeah, what happened there? I have really bad runway anxiety like it's Yeah, not for me, but so my feet were sweating and You know everyone backstage was kind of doing what they could you know taping my shoes to my feet But I was just sweating right through them and at that point there was there was nothing they could do They they told me to go out there and have fun I was like, I'm not gonna have fun when my shoes come off.  But yeah, the idea immediately slips off right next to Anna Wintour of all people so yeah, the internet kind of went crazy with that and It's still kind of hard to live that down a lot of people a lot of people know me because of that incident Which you know, I I don't feel any type of way about And what is that that's saying bad publicity is is still publicity or whatever Yeah, so I think you know It kind of did things for my career at the same time But not everything like I already had a name for myself, but people do associate me with with that very heavily But it's very common. It's very common to have a runway mishap. It happens Very often almost at every show but mine I guess I don't know why it you know Caught the attention it did but yeah, it's very very common. I want

Melanie Avalon

I wonder if it's because like when I was looking at the video and reading articles about it, it was presented like you purposely took them off. Like I didn't realize they slipped off and then you picked them up and carried them. I'm guessing is what happened.

Grace Valentine

yeah a lot of people thought that it was kind of an orchestrated thing which means I'm doing my job right but it was yeah it happened

Melanie Avalon

It's interesting because you were talking earlier about, you know, becoming comfortable on the camera and are some people born with that or not. Just like watching that video and other stuff, like the confidence you exude is, I find it so inspiring.  Like, how are you feeling now when you do those projects and your evolution of that? So like that confidence that you project, is that real? Are you nervous still?

Grace Valentine

How do you feel? No, it's definitely real. I know it took me a minute to get here, but also, I think largely is because I separate the job from my ego. Yeah, I think that's really important of me. I never let it impact who I am.  And I think that's why my confidence stays the same. Because the work that I do, even though it's rather impressive, it still is not everything to who I am. And then even on the negative side, getting a negative comment or whatever, it still doesn't go through that barrier that I've built around myself to have that confidence.

Melanie Avalon

I love this so much. Speaking of negative comments, do you get on social media and look at things like that or how do you engage in a healthy way with that?

Grace Valentine

Yeah, I'm really not big on the whole social media thing actually. I will have moments where I'll completely deactivate my Instagram, like you can't even find my account. I think that's the healthiest thing for me and my mental health to just not pay attention to social media, you know, looking up my name, looking up comments, things like that. But even at that, like when those happen, I tend to brush them off really easily because I've experienced that throughout my entire life. Yeah, it's just gone to a point where it's like it's so tiring that I just don't even let it get to me anymore.  And the people saying these things don't know me on a personal level either. And they're coming from my appearance, which I think is like also like the least interesting thing about myself and about people. So how like, I don't know, how impactful can their comments be if that's how I see it.

Melanie Avalon

I love hearing that, especially the dichotomy of, you know, you saying your appearance is the, you know, the least impactful or important thing here when people idolize runway models and we'll give anything for that one appearance aspect. And so it's really empowering to hear, you know, that that's not the be all end all.  So you've hinted at it a few times earlier, you're saying something about your thoughts on body image and, you know, and just now things that you've gone through. So your personal story growing up and getting into, you know, what you experienced with friends and mental health and wellness, what happened in your childhood involving those issues.

Grace Valentine

So, yeah, with my appearance, I mean, just, you know, the typical kind of bullying. It was never physical, but more like words and, you know, word stick. Things like, oh, you look like a monkey or you're so thin, like, just stuff that you really kind of take into consideration when you're hearing growing up. But I knew those things weren't important.  I knew people saying those things. Sometimes it was more a reflection of them and how they feel about themselves. And like, although, like, yeah, it's still hurt to hear, it just wasn't like everything. I never became obsessed over it or like tried to change those things. I was still very much myself. I've never not been myself. I've never struggled to not be myself. And I think that's a great thing. I think that's paid off in the long run to not try to like fit into whatever people want me to be. But yeah, growing up with that appearance aspect, yeah, I don't know, it was not really something I really focused on that much. The mental health aspect, my biological father was not a great dude, is not a great dude. Very verbal physical abuse that went on from when I was four until I was 11. I went through those years, those developing years, I wasn't able to tell anybody about it. So it became this internalized thing that manifested itself into complex post-traumatic stress disorder, which then eventually became borderline personality disorder. So from four to 11, I went through these things. And then after that was kind of when I was able to start talking about it and sitting with it and processing it and it was just so heavy because I didn't realize how wrong it was growing up. And yeah, it was just a really difficult thing for a young kid to have to manage. Lots of stays in the mental hospitals, lots of medications, lots of psychiatrists and therapists and just talking about it all the time.  And I don't know, it was just probably the biggest part of my childhood and my teenage years I think. Yeah, and then when I was about 17, I really started displaying those common borderline symptoms and I've had a few suicide attempts throughout those years I mentioned. So when I was 18, I had an attempt which led me into the hospital and I was there for a while and they were asking me kind of their routine questions and they came with the borderline diagnosis and it wasn't really talked about at the time. I remember I Googled it and Google really kind of only said that Pete Davidson has it and it's like this, you know, just not a lot of, like it made sense. I was like, okay, yeah, but what now? So I'm really glad that it's talked about a lot more. I think there is still a big stigma around it and I'm kind of put in this box of people just kind of automatically make assumptions or write me off as a bad person or, you know, whatever they think BPD is. So I'm not very vocal about my diagnosis anymore, but I'm not ashamed of it.  Yeah, no, my childhood was unusual, but there's nothing that I would change about it because it made me who I am emotionally and mentally and I do find myself to be really compassionate and layered and really artistic as well.

Grace Valentine

I express a lot of my emotions through writing and making music and dancing and things like that. So I guess, yeah, like maybe that's like the silver lining in it is who you become after it.

Melanie Avalon

This is so incredible. And thank you so much for being so vulnerable and sharing all of this.  It's really amazing. And I'll clarify because you mentioned your biological father. So I should have said this earlier, Gordy is your stepfather. So different people.

Grace Valentine

Yeah, no, Gordy's, he's the best. I love him so much.

Melanie Avalon

much. He's really amazing.  So you have such a strong, I feel like you have such a strong sense of identity in who you are, which is so, so cool. When you got those diagnoses, like the borderline personality disorder, and you did touch on this, but did it change your personal identity at all? Like I know you said it felt like a stigma and how it affected how people saw you. Did it change how you saw yourself at all? A little bit.

Grace Valentine

But at first, I think I became a bit more hopeless. Things on the internet, they were like, oh, it's high rates of suicide and there's no medication for it. It's just therapy. I didn't even know that you could be in remission from BPD until about two or three years ago. So I always thought it's something you couldn't heal from. You're just going to be like this for the rest of your life.  I found that really difficult to manage. I definitely spiraled and started acting out after that. I remember I was arrested for shoplifting. I was experimenting with drugs, just not on a good path because I just felt hopeless. I felt like if I'm going to die early, allegedly, then let me just do what I want to do. Let me just be a little delinquent and go crazy.

Melanie Avalon

Wow, so it's interesting because obviously the purpose of the labels is to help in theory that the purpose is to understand humans and find answers and at the same time, you know, I just think it's really interesting how it does put people in boxes and have these effects.  So like if you had kids, for example, and they got diagnosed with something, would you want them to even like know that diagnosis?

Grace Valentine

Yeah, I think there is a huge sense of relief and finally having the answer because even though I acted out afterwards, it was almost unbearable to kind of just feel so like you can't put your finger on it, but it's there and it's the elephant in the room and you don't know how to talk about it enough because it's so hard and complex to articulate. So when you just have kind of the answer written out for you and it becomes easier to explain to other people and to yourself. So I'm definitely glad I have that answer.  I think having that answer has benefited me much more than, you know, if I didn't have it now, I wonder if, you know, I would still act in ways where, you know, I felt like I couldn't get it. Help or like I was just going to be stuck like that. And that's just how I was at my core and not how my brain functioned or, you know, like not something I could get help for. Yeah. So if I had kids, I, you know, I would encourage them to hold space for that and not make it their entire identity. But, you know, they probably understand themselves a lot better.

Melanie Avalon

I touch on childhood trauma a lot on this show, usually as a topic within a broader topic of an interview. I have done though, actually a few months ago, I did an entire show. The book was called Vulnerable Minds and it was all about childhood trauma and it was fascinating.  Mark Hauser was his name. I'm curious your experience with your childhood trauma and all of those modalities that you're experiencing, so therapy and medications. Was there a theme of anything that was helpful? Was it individual and that it depended on the medication or it depended on a therapist? Coming out of that, what did you learn for what was helpful for people in that type of situation? I think,

Grace Valentine

therapy, talk therapy Finally being able to talk about it after years of being told I couldn't talk about it Yeah, that was very strange at first. But yeah, that's definitely what I needed is to just know that it was wrong and now I can talk about it and and Hear like what I should do next Have that insight and advice Yeah, I started on medication Pretty young too.  I think I was like nine I'm yeah I'm personally not a huge fan of medication just because I feel like it strips me of that identity that I have and Like I don't know. I don't really like myself on medication but yeah, I've been through that process of different Antidepressants and mood stabilizers and and things like that. Yeah, nothing helps me As much as talk therapy and then ketamine therapy, but we'll get to that. Yeah

Melanie Avalon

Yeah. Do you still see a therapist now? Yeah, I do. Yeah. I am all about therapy.  I just think it's like the best thing. I've been going... When did I start going? I think I started going in 2014. So I've been going pretty much, I mean, most weeks for like a decade. The thing I always want to say to people about it is that, like how important it is to find the therapist that is right for you because I know I've like had a journey of trying to find a therapist that was right for me and I've had some pretty bad like therapist interviews. It's like dating in a way. Sometimes people I think will try therapy but they just won't find the right person for them and so they kind of write it off.  Have you been seeing the same person for a while or what has that been like?

Grace Valentine

Yeah, my current therapist is the longest therapist I've had, but also, I've only been seeing her for a year and a half, maybe. So it's not that long, but yeah, you can imagine the amount of therapists I've had in my lifetime if this is the longest I've had one, but I've been in therapy since I was nine. Yeah, but she's great. She's great.  I feel like I'm at a point where I don't need therapy, at least right now, but I still will go see her. I find it very insightful, even if I have nothing going on. Yeah, I've had some pretty bad therapists. After my BPD diagnosis, my therapist basically quit on me. She told me she couldn't. It was too much of a liability for her. So that was difficult to ... If your therapist quits on you, what does that say about you? It's what was going through my mind then, and a small part of what led to that recklessness afterwards. I've had therapists fall asleep on me.

Melanie Avalon

Me too. I've actually had a therapist quit on me too. I'm like dying right now. I'm like, yep, I had that happen to me too. It's so awkward when they fall asleep on you.  Yeah. Oh my goodness. Okay. I was doing when my therapist fell asleep on me, not my current one, I was doing, I don't know if you've done brain spotting where you look certain directions and listen to music and talk. I was monologuing essentially, and then she fell asleep and I was like, do I keep talking? Oh man. I also had a therapist quit on me after five or six sessions because I went in for a certain issue that he specialized in. Then after five or six sessions, he was like, I don't think this is your problem. I can't help you. He fired me. I was like, like you said, I was like, wait, am I the problem here? I'm confused.

Grace Valentine

leaving you high and dry to figure it out yourself.

Melanie Avalon

Yeah, that's wild. Well, you must have had a lot if it's been since nine and your streak now is a year and a half.  Yeah. That's awesome though that you found somebody that you like. I feel the same. Even if I don't have anything acute going on that I feel like I quote need to work on, it's just nice to go in and be able to like dump out my life and get feedback and learn about yourself and grow. So I'm all about it. So speaking of the spiraling, what stopped the spiraling?

Grace Valentine

Honestly, modeling, when I started my career, it was so real and so adult and so like okay you live in New York City now like you fly to you like you're with all these like top top top people like you you don't have room to be acting like this anymore like you really have to yeah it was my own self-discipline really I mean I internally I still struggled but externally you know yeah I had to be on my game for for my job

Melanie Avalon

Wow, that really makes sense. And we talked a little bit about this.  I'm so in awe of... You said you'll find out... So what is the turnaround time of when you find out about a job and then you're doing the job? How does that process go down?

Grace Valentine

I mean, it could be the night before. It's so last minute.  When I first started, my agent would text me and she'd be like, oh, how are you? By the way, you have to fight a Korea tonight. And I'm just like, oh, okay, cool. Yeah, naturally. So, I mean, now I have more space. Now I know I might be going to Paris in a few days, like I can mentally prepare. But it was so quick and so chaotic, but in the best way. But I adjusted quite quickly, like surprisingly. Yeah, I've really, really, really surprised myself with my ability to really step up. I've never had to hold myself like that before. And on my own too, like my parents are back in Pittsburgh and I'm out here by myself. So I'm really impressed and I'm really proud of myself for that.

Melanie Avalon

That's amazing because you said you have a little bit more time now. Is that something where as you progress in your model career, the jobs, like, is it like when you first start, they're kind of giving you the last minute jobs and that's why it's so fast of a turnaround or like, like, why do you have more space or time now?

Grace Valentine

not even sure if it has to do with the work. I think because my agents are aware of my stressors and just kind of feeling overwhelmed, I think I'm going into my sixth year now of modeling. I think if it were still like that, I would just be so stressed out if everything was so last minute and all over the place like that. So I think it's both a combination of, yeah, how long I've been doing it, but also because they know I'm more sensitive and I kind of need to breathe now.  I've, you know, made a name for myself. I've showed up. I do my work, but like it can be balanced for sure.

Melanie Avalon

I'm just super curious, how long, so like if you have a runway show in Paris, how long is a typical day? Like how long is the event?

Grace Valentine

shows I mean usually typically it's like only four hours before like you pull up four hours hair and makeup rehearsal and then you do the show but that's not the case for a whole day because I could be doing two three shows in a day with fittings in between or castings things like that so those four hour days turn into like 15 hour days really quickly

Melanie Avalon

Do you see the same people? Like, did you make model friends that you see a lot?

Grace Valentine

Yeah, my friends are really spaced out. My best friend lives in Paris. Everyone's just all over the place. It's easy to feel lonely, is more what I meant to say.  But it's nice when I get to come together and see them because I might be going to Paris in a few days. That means I get to see my best friend. So it's exciting. It's a good trade-off. Yeah, but it's worldwide, which is crazy. But it also makes the world feel a bit smaller, too.

Melanie Avalon

Oh, I bet. I'm just in awe.  Like, traveling is not... Like, I'm traveling to Sundance this weekend, and I've been mentally preparing for it for, like, a month. Basically, I'm not good with the travel. Do you have tips for just how you live that life and tips for, like, traveling and sleep and all the things with the changing time zones and the turnaround and the plane trips?

Grace Valentine

Yeah, okay, well, first of all, I'm jealous you're going to Sundance. It's really cool. Have you been? No, no, but I love that. I'm about the whole thing.

Melanie Avalon

You should come this weekend. You're good with the last minute travel. Like one of my best friends from film school, his film got into Sundance. So I'm so excited, it should be fun.

Grace Valentine

Yeah, that's that's really nice. But I, I think with time, I became better with traveling, but my biggest my go tos, headphones, headphones, a window seat. Yeah, like bring your own food on the plane. But with jet lag, and all that it kind of I think because my body is so like, on the go, I adjust to the to the jet lag well, because I think I'm used to it at this point. But allowing myself to be tired is not something I really do, which, you know, might not be the healthiest thing.  But I do allow myself to have a lot of rest after the fact. So I make up for it. We are traveling is a lot less stressful now. Yeah, I'm kind of I kind of I feel like I could do the whole airport security everything with my eyes closed at this point. Because I'm just yeah, I'm just so can easily be stressful though. But I'm definitely, definitely got the hang of it. Yeah, I'm trying to think of some some tips. But really, I just I put my headphones on and I kind of just zip on through and do what I have to do. And I'm at my gate and then on the plane with my headphones on hood up, like just sunglasses on just like in my own little world, making it comfortable for me. Do I

Melanie Avalon

the flight movies, the in-flight movies.

Grace Valentine

sometimes I try to just sleep I try to force myself to sleep or I'll play a game on my phone or started reading which is cool yeah you got to make it comfortable when you're on a plane for 8 9 10 11 12 hours you kind of have to make friends with it and I used to be terrified of flying so so so scared like looking at everybody when the plane starts shaking like I start shaking my heart is racing really really bad and I still have that but I think because I'm I'm so used to it now and I've been on I don't know how many planes in the last six years I'm kind of just like whatever like it's it's fine it all it all takes time I guess

Melanie Avalon

It's inspiring. It's like exposure therapy. Like basically, if you just do the thing that you kind of like both things in your life, like one, you're saying how, what kind of what stopped the spiraling was you just had to show up, you know, like doing the job, like forced you into that and then with the traveling just like doing it a lot. I think the scariest thing when people are like scared of things, it's often just that first, like that first step. And then if you actually just do it, you know, ongoing, it can be really helpful.  So the ketamine journey, when, when did that start? How did that first come on your radar?

Grace Valentine

So, I did TMS, I think, what is that, Sandberg Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation, I think, don't quote me on that. I did that in January of 2022, heard so many great things, unfortunately, it didn't help me.  And basically, you know, you're sitting down in a chair, they put this thing over your head, it makes like a tapping noise, it doesn't hurt, it just, you know, it's just a consistent tapping noise, and not sure the signs behind it, or I don't remember at least, but yeah, it's supposed to be for like treatment resistant depression, which is definitely where I fall for that, or fallen for that. So because that didn't help, I, they had suggested they, they had told me about ketamine therapy. And I was like, okay, ketamine, like, that's not, you know, I'm not crazy about drugs, at least anymore. And also IVs, I don't like needles, so I just like, no, no, like, no, I'm good. But I went through a really bad breakup in 2022. I, I was counting my days, it was really, really dark, it was the darkest I had ever gotten. So by November of 2022, I was so desperate, it was either death or I guess ketamine therapy.  So I, my mom found a clinic in Florida, and yeah, I started doing it. I think the first time you do it, it's like six sessions, so it's like twice a week for three weeks. And I was so blown away at what that could do. So fascinated by the science of it, I mean, it rewires your, your brain chemistry, it creates new pathways for, for thinking. Yeah, not only that, but just like, what I was getting out of it too, I was like, I had no idea I could feel this way. I had no idea that, you know, I could smile and mean it and, and find joy and be okay if that goes away because I know it'll come back just, you know, just peace, just, I remember I went to bed that night after my first session and I was scared to die. For the first time in my life, I was afraid to die. I was so upset that I had ever thought about taking my life and trying to and considering not giving life a shot and, and dealing with what life throws my way. So when I came back to New York, I found a clinic here and by that point, I didn't need those six sessions at, you know, it was once a month, I think. So I was doing it once a month, just yeah. And I haven't done it since July of last year because I, I'm the best I've ever been in my entire life.  I'm so at peace. I'm so like, I wish my teenage self could see me now because it's, it's a whole other person. It's the other side of the coin. It's, it's so beautiful to me. I think that's like the most impressive thing about myself that I, that I, I'll get on my high horse about is like how, yeah, no, just how I was able to overcome everything that I have gone through. And that doesn't mean like, I don't have bad days, I still do, but I hold them with compassion rather than, you know, my life is so like, I'm never going to get better. It's bad again. Like, of course, but like, no, I'm, I'm so like, I'm a pro at this now.

Grace Valentine

Like, I know what to do. I know what to tell myself. I know the self-care steps to take. I know like what works for me and what doesn't and, and then I work on it.  I confront it. I sit with it. I hold it. I make it my friend. Yeah. I'm, I'm the best I've ever been.

Melanie Avalon

is so incredible. Do you know from what you've researched on ketamine if do most people see effects that quickly after the first session? I don't know actually.  That's so profound. It's it's upsetting to me that you know these types of they shouldn't even be the word drug like it's a problem to me that we use the one word drug to describe everything like pharmaceutical medications illegal not healthy drugs like cocaine and things like that and then these psychedelic type drugs that can you know be so profoundly helpful for people but we call them all drugs so it even caffeine is like a drug it's all so different and then there's you know all the I think it's getting better now with approvals and things getting more studied and and out there for for helping people but um I feel like it's been a long journey.  I personally haven't tried anything but that's so profound. So did you when you had that when it changed you like that did you feel like you changed identity wise as a person at all or was it just that you were losing these fears and thoughts and perspectives like like how did it feel like you as grace through all of this?

Grace Valentine

I think I became like Grace times 10 after that. Nothing changed on the outside. I very much still dress very cool and listen to my cool music and the outer things that make me who I am. But because I had this new part of me where I can basically confront and handle and work through these hard parts, it was very elevating, I guess.  Yeah, I became a much better, softer, kinder version of myself towards myself, which then reflected in my outer life. I wasn't so angry at the world anymore. And I think it also really helped with my confidence for work too. Now that I'm not holding on to this darkness anymore, now that I'm in this new part of my life, and I don't need to hold on to this past, it really changed things for work as well. You can tell someone's emotions to their eyes and you can see right through mine, you can see all that emotion in there. I'm always hearing, oh, you look so sad, oh, are you okay? But now, I smile with my eyes and I mean it when I say I'm good, and yeah.

Melanie Avalon

You started the ketamine journey while you were already modeling, right?

Grace Valentine

Yeah, so I started modeling July 2019. I didn't start ketamine until November 2022. Okay.

Melanie Avalon

Do you remember the first shoot that you did after starting ketamine? Yeah, I think...

Grace Valentine

it was abroad. I think it was it was in Paris and it was cold and I don't like shooting in the cold but I didn't mind. I felt very grateful to be there.  I felt very like new perspective on everything. Yeah it really really translated in my work. Before ketamine I was always taking breaks from work from my mental health to the point I became a bit scared about my career like oh are they just gonna write me off as I'm not you know capable of showing up and doing it but luckily like there was compassion there was empathy but yeah I haven't I took a break once I went to a rehab facility in 2023 but I had relapsed with certain things and yeah I haven't taken a break since that basically. I haven't been in the in a mental hospital in almost two years which is like the longest I've gone.

Melanie Avalon

Wow, do you think it reflects in like the photos and stuff, the ketamine, like could you like identify pre-ketamine and post-ketamine grace if you were to see the shoots?

Grace Valentine

Yeah, definitely. It's definitely in my eyes. Yeah.

Melanie Avalon

That's so cool. And how do you feel about your future with potentially, like, are you open to, scared of, don't think you will go into a rehab type situation again? Like, how do you feel about that?

Grace Valentine

No, I definitely have because this rehab was like it was half rehab part mental facility I I was heavily heavily abusing Xanax Around this time like after my my said breakup Nobody knew my parents didn't know they just thought I was going to this place for the Mental health part of it, but I was yeah, I was on Xanax very heavily And now i'm i'm in a really good place with all of these things and yeah, I don't see myself relapsing Yeah, just taking really good care of myself right now

Melanie Avalon

I will refer listeners. I interviewed, the book was called Blood Orange Night. It was Melissa Bond and she told all about her experience with benzodiazepines and that book blew my mind. I had no idea about the essentially like how people can get into situations where they're, you know, taking those and they're really hard to get off of. I applaud you for any journey you had there because, yeah, reading that book, I was like, oh, I had no idea. Like, why is nobody talking about this?  Because doctors will just so, you know, quickly prescribe Xanax. Like, it's no big deal and, you know, these other drugs and, okay. So your thoughts on beauty standards and image, you're in the industry that is seemingly all about that. How do you feel about image and beauty standards and you and other people and what are your thoughts?

Grace Valentine

Okay, well, to preface, I respect the work I do, I respect the artistry of it, I respect how hard people work in it, but I do find the the appearance, beauty standard aspect, which is the whole entire thing, basically, to be a bit silly. Because I mean, like I said earlier, like, that's not all there is to me, but that's not all there is to everybody else on this earth. I definitely judge a person by their character and not their appearance, which I think should be the standard.  Like my personal experience, like I've never heard like, Oh, you have to eat this. Oh, you can't eat that you have to exit like I've never, I've always been good enough, actually, like pretty on par with what they're looking for, which is actually a bit concerning because I am severely underweight. So I always thought that was a bit strange that they praised me so much for for that. But to hear what what other girls have gone to had to go through and and living in a model apartment and experiencing eating disorders firsthand and and it's very dangerous. It's very, very, I hold a lot of a lot of compassion for these girls because we're we're so young, a lot of them are coming from foreign countries and leaving their families behind. And in hopes of, you know, getting getting good work and being able to provide for their families and themselves, they're willing to risk their health for that. And and I don't know if I would ever let modeling be that I don't want to say that's serious, because I don't I don't want to disrespect them like like what modeling means to these girls who need it for financial reasons. But I yeah, I don't know if I would allow myself mentally to get to a point where I'm letting it control my life down to to what I eat or what I wear or how I see myself or how I see others. I've seen it quickly go to girls heads, just being praised for for their appearance. And then they start acting different and they get a bigger ego and they start treating people really poorly. And it's if anything, it's I mean, it's a lesson that I've already known my whole life, but it's just a reminder to keep doing what I'm doing and to find the importance and the beauty from within and not the outside. So it's a bit I feel like a hypocrite sometimes that I say these things and I feel these things and I think these things yet I'm working in the the most like.

Melanie Avalon

seemingly superficial industry? Yeah, yeah. I think you're doing an incredible job. You're being so eloquent at communicating and expressing. It's nuanced and it's complex and you're really expressing that. So my point is I don't think you're a hypocrite or anything.  So it seems like just naturally your body is, like you said, the stats that they want. Were you ever concerned that it was going to make you like disordered with your eating or anything like that? Or was that not, were you not concerned about that personally?

Grace Valentine

I was concerned about the opposite. Actually, my weight fluctuates so easily and when I get more depressed, I don't eat, I lose weight quickly. I was scared of losing so much weight that, you know, not just for work but for like my mental health as well.  Like my experience with disordered eating is that I will count calories to make sure they're enough and not too little. It's kind of like the opposite of most of these girls. Yeah, like I said, I don't really like the praise I've gotten for being the standard because I'm not healthy. I'm not, you know, a role model for that. I shouldn't be considered a beauty standard.

Melanie Avalon

the ketamine therapy helped that at all? Yeah, yeah.

Grace Valentine

the eating, yeah. Yeah, I don't even think about about eating anymore. I just, it's just, I eat what I please when I want to. I eat when I'm hungry. I eat healthy foods. I eat comforting foods. I just don't put thought into it anymore.  I feel mentally healthy enough. And that reflects on my body. And I'm grateful to be in this spot. Because, I mean, even as a kid, like I know I mentioned at the beginning, like, I was told I was too skinny, and I would have to see doctors for it. And it was like, it was a thing. But I'm, I'm happy to be at a point where I, I don't think about it anymore. And I do what I can to make my body feel good. And that's enough for me. And I don't need it to be enough for even anything for anybody else.

Melanie Avalon

Yeah, that's amazing. I think that's something that haunts so many people, like just trying to feel like they're enough for whatever, whatever it is.  I think people just, I know I struggle with that. Do you see yourself, like how long do you see yourself doing this career? I don't even know what's normal. Like is there like an expiration date for people?

Grace Valentine

I because this is my sixth year. I feel a bit like oh am I aging out like oh like what's next like kind of Freaking out a little bit about like it what it what's next but I'm still I'm still working I'm not I'm not worried about it. Like nothing has changed. Nothing has made me Think this way other than starting my sixth year cuz I don't know if like what's what's the timeline? Yeah, I'm comfortable with it for now.  I'm I'm I am Lucky enough that I get days off and I can spend those days focusing on what I like to do like I was just working on music before I jumped on here with you and just and finding those those things too because I'm very much a The world and humanity and civilization should not focus around work and our value should not be attached to our work so I I really Take for I take advantage of of the time that I have to enjoy myself But because we live in a society where you have to work I I am trying to figure out that next step as well. And I think that's that's kind of leaning more towards psychology Maybe I used to work in a nursing home as a teenager and that was by far the most rewarding job I've I've ever had I think I would kind of lean back into that like homemade care like nursing home care That kind of kind of thing anything with with helping people just you know That's my that's my thing for sure

Melanie Avalon

It's so awesome. I'm grateful for me that the primary work I do with everything is what I just so genuinely love so it doesn't even feel like work. I'm really personally grateful for that.  I'm curious, what type of music do you make?

Grace Valentine

It's kind of all over the place. I'm actually working on like a really silly rap album right now, but I just put out an album in October, which is stuff like more sad, more haunting things or sounds rather that I had been working on for like the past two years. I decided to release it, to let go of it and start the next thing.  So now I've been tapping back into my rapping. I used to love writing raps growing up or writing music in general, but raps are just so fun because it's just poetry and I love poetry. So it's all over the place. It's yeah.

Melanie Avalon

That's amazing. What's the first album called? That album is called Letters to the Lilies. Is it on like Spotify and stuff? Mm-hmm, yeah. Awesome.  I'm gonna check it out. That's awesome. Wow, this has been amazing. I'm super curious out of all the modeling stuff that you've done, what was your favorite moment?

Grace Valentine

I got to shoot a cover for Heist Nobiety, which is more of like Hypebeast streetwear sort of magazine. And that was really cool because I had read that magazine before I even started modeling. And I was never really into fashion. I just thought it was a really, really cool magazine.  Yeah, so they did a cover on me and a whole story about like this, like my mental health and my journey and my music and my career. And it was so cool. That was the most personal, most intimate thing I've ever done in my career so far. That's definitely a highlight. I also think anytime I've gotten to work with my friends or my family, that's also really special. I got to shoot a jewelry campaign for Louis Vuitton with my mom a couple years ago. My twin brother and I, we did the Vogue thing. Yeah, it's all really, really special when I have moments like that.

Melanie Avalon

That's so cool. Is there a dream job that you would want? Like a dream modeling shoot project?

Grace Valentine

Not really. I used to get asked that question a lot, but I didn't want to like attach any like Expectations or like hope or like if it comes up it comes up and that's cool And it's that's really I appreciate it and and I'm excited, but yeah I never I don't know. I'm not I don't want to say I never cared enough about modeling to You know creep like have a have a dream job, but I don't know. I just never put much thought into it I've always just been super open to what comes so cool.  So like what was the last job you worked? Oh, I just oh my god. Yeah, my last job was for Vogue magazine this month US Vogue. It just came out It's it's February. Yeah, I got to write a skateboard for it, which is so cool cuz I I used to skateboard Yeah, it's a picture of me doing an ollie in Chanel, which is proper skater attire Um always Yeah, no, that was the last job.  I did it was like a story on like how models get around the city Do you skate do skateboard now? It's harder in New York and my agents have advised me to be careful in other words Don't do it. So you don't break a bone or hurt yourself.  Yeah. No, I enjoy it I have a video game. I'm playing right now that is skateboarding. So I guess you know, that's kind of enough for me Yeah

Melanie Avalon

counts. Oh, well, that's awesome.  Going back briefly to the ketamine thing, for people who are struggling with their own mental health issues and journeys, I don't even want to say issues, but their challenges, given your experience with ketamine, like, do you really encourage people to try it? Like, how do you feel about, you know, its potential for other people?

Grace Valentine

I really do encourage it. A close friend of mine was actually asking yesterday about my experience with it because she's considering it. And I'm pretty much since day one, I've been saying like, I swear by this, this is like the best thing I could have done for myself.  I know like it might seem a bit like ketamine, whatever. Like the science behind it, I encourage you to read about it. I encourage you to make yourself comfortable with the idea. To think like I spent all these years on medications and talk therapy and still couldn't find that relief I was looking for. And then I do, I start ketamine and it was almost basically instant. And still like the long-term effects, I still, you know, I've done the work enough to feel those effects. It should get more representation, honestly. And I don't wanna say like, oh, it'll work for everybody because I don't know. But for me at least, like I swear with all my treatment resistant depression and anxiety and things like this, ketamine was my answer. Yeah.

Melanie Avalon

It's incredible and I'll put links in the show notes because there's a lot of studies on it showing how effective it can be for treating these things.  The actual experience of taking it, because I've never done anything like this, how does it feel actually when you're actually taking it on it?

Grace Valentine

it's so euphoric.  I mean like any if you if you have any experience like dissociative kind of psychedelics basically that like you're you're kind of feel like you're in another realm but in that realm like you're you're confronting all these things and it can get a bit scary but like that's you know kind of where you start digging through that that darkness to find the beauty and and the relief yeah it's it's helpful if you set an intention going into it so I would always think like the night before the morning of like oh what oh what do I want to get out of today a lot of that was in my childhood and and the things that I have been through and it's so so weird that I'm able to kind of take myself back to to that like I'm that little kid again but I have my mind I have now and I can really work through this because I'm two places at once and and I can look at it differently and it's almost like kind of giving yourself a second chance at it and and doing it differently and from that you learn and you you grow and then you find that relief and overall like at least for me like I really started holding myself with a lot of compassion and yeah yeah it changed everything

Melanie Avalon

for me. It's so incredible and inspiring.  And thank you for sharing about it. Yeah, this has been so, so incredible. Is there anything else you wanted to share with listeners about your personal story or what you would like people to know?

Grace Valentine

Not necessarily. I'm just, I'm very open about all of this and I have found it to be helpful for other people so I'm really glad that I was able to come on here with you today and share this.  I think that's more rewarding for me than anything is knowing that I played a bit of a role in helping somebody so they don't, so they know they're not alone. I think that's like my biggest thing is growing up feeling so alone and I couldn't talk about it. I want to now be that voice, the voice that wants you to talk about it, encourages you to talk about it and know that it's okay and that you're not alone. I think that's a really big thing for me.

Melanie Avalon

It's amazing. You could be a podcaster. You could, you could have a show. Yeah. No, this has been absolutely incredible.  And the show notes, again, I'll put links to some of the research on ketamine. I'll put the links to, you know, Grace's work so people can check you out. The last question that I ask every single guest on this show, and it is just because I am so obsessed with and realize the importance of mindset with everything. So what is something that you're grateful for?

Grace Valentine

I'm really grateful for myself, for not giving up. I think there were so many times where I nearly did and so many times I wanted to. And for some reason, I just stuck around and I kept going. And on days I couldn't keep going, I just kept breathing because that was enough.  Yeah, I'm really grateful for. I think it's my inner child, that resilient, almost disobedient, not wanting to give up. But even though I wanted to, just for pushing through, for not giving up on myself.

Melanie Avalon

I love that so much. Well, thank you, Grace. It's really incredible. Just what you're doing, your life, the content you create. I didn't really comment on my thoughts on modeling in the industry and everything, but I find it like you're saying, it is an art and I find it very cool and I like looking at it and I love that you were able to capture all of that, like the creativity and the talent and the work that you produce and also have this really nuanced understanding of what's under the surface and what really matters and the purpose and the love behind everything.  Thank you for sharing your journey and being so vulnerable and especially for sharing about Academy and hopefully people listening, hopefully this can help somebody or somebody they know. So yeah, this was wonderful. Thank you so much. It's really an honor to get to know you in this. So thank you. Yeah, thank you. All right. Have a good rest of your day and enjoy your next crazy trip to who knows where. Thank you. Bye. Bye. Thanks. Thank you so much for listening to the Melanie Avalon biohacking podcast. For more information and resources, you can check out my book, What Win Wine, as well as my supplement line, Avalon X. Please visit Melanie Avalon.com to learn more about today's guests and always feel free to contact me at contact at Melanie Avalon.com and always remember, you got this.