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The Melanie Avalon Biohacking Podcast Episode #128 - Dr. Michael Platt

Dr. Platt received his MD from N.Y. Medical College.
He has been board certified in internal medicine.
He has worked for various medical groups, and as a hospitalist.
He has been a medical director for about 40 long term care facilities.

Since 1997, the Platt Wellness Center has been a pioneer in the research and advancement of the therapeutic use of progesterone cream and other bio-identical hormones. Platt is considered an important pioneer in observational, functional, alternative, and allopathic medicine focused on bio-identical hormones and adrenaline overload.
His award-winning books, ā€œThe Miracle of Bio-Identical Hormonesā€, How I Lost My...fatigue, hot flashes, ADHD, ADD, fibromyalgia, PMS, osteoporosis, weight, sexual dysfunction, anger, migrainesā€¦ and ā€œAdrenaline Dominance, A Revolutionary Approach to Wellnessā€, detail his Platt Protocol: solutions for conditions modern medicine considers ā€˜incurableā€™ and that are ā€˜treatedā€™ with drugs, endless office visits and tests. He has identified many conditions that respond positively to bio-identical hormones, especially progesterone. Conditions that affect millions of people worldwide such as: ADHD, fibromyalgia, autism, depression, bipolar disorder, addictions, weight gain, anger, road rage, irritable bowel syndrome (IBS) and more.



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The Miracle of Bio-Identical Hormones: Author Dr. Platt (2nd Edition)

Adrenaline Dominance: A Revolutionary Approach to Wellness

11:45 - Michael Platt's Background

13:50 - adrenaline

14:50 - How does hormones Dysregulation start?

15:50 - why do we hormones drop during aging?

17:50 - what is progesterone and what is it's role?

19:20 - cholesterol 

20:25 - triglyceride ratios

21:55 - low cholesterol levels

22:25 - estrogen and insulin

24:35 - the purpose of progesterone

25:40 - DRY FARM WINES: Low Sugar, Low Alcohol, Toxin-Free, Mold-Free, Pesticide-Free, Hang-Over Free Natural Wine! Use The Link DryFarmWines.Com/Melanieavalon To Get A Bottle For A Penny!

27:50 - is it really a miracle hormone?

28:40 - PCOS

30:05 - hormone stimulating signals

31:30 - estrogen prescription

35:40 - progesterone effects and side effects

36:30 - insulin resistance in the brain

38:40 - oral progesterone vs creams

39:45 - is the transdermal application localized or systemic?

41:00 - application protocol

42:00 - where are hormones produced?

44:20 - what is adrenaline and what is it's connection to ADHD?

47:10 - can progesterone help ADHD?

49:55 - glucose from vegetables

50:20 - ketones for the brain

51:35 - overactive bladder and urgency incontinence

52:20 - using progesterone to control the insulin response to eating

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The Melanie Avalon Biohacking Podcast Episode #38 - Connie Zack
The Science Of Sauna: Heat Shock Proteins, Heart Health, Chronic Pain, Detox, Weight Loss, Immunity, Traditional Vs. Infrared, And More!

54:10 - adrenaline and cortisol

55:55 - adrenal fatigue

58:00 - low carb diets and cortisol

59:05 - MCT oil and energy toxicity

1:00:20 - vegan & low fat diets

1:01:30 - is there a certain age you'll need to supplement?

1:02:10 - Controversy in modern medicine

1:03:50 - testosterone

1:05:00 - low sex drive

1:08:00 - fibromyalgia

1:09:40 - Tinnitus

1:09:50 - Migraines

1:11:50 - restless legs, And More!

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Melanie Avalon: Hi, friends, welcome back to the show. I am so incredibly excited about the conversation that I am about to have and I am so excited to tell you the backstory on what led up to this. So, I have been very aware of the, I want to say obvious, importance of hormones and our health and our entire well-being. But I hadn't really done a deep, deep dive into the science of all of them and how they affect our body. I had just gone on my own rabbit hole tangents on the internet learning about things. Interestingly enough about six years ago, one of my holistic practitioners actually suggested that I take oral progesterone for various health-related issues. I quickly did a research and realized that probably wasn't what I should be doing and I switched myself over to a progesterone cream, and I've been very fascinated with the role of progesterone and health. So, I was super excited to be exposed to the work of Dr. Michael Platt. He has a few books but, I, in particular read his two books. One, The Miracle of Bio-identical Hormones: How I Lost My Fatigue, Hot flashes, ADHD/ADD, Fibromyalgia, PMS, Osteoporosis, Weight, Sexual dysfunction, Anger, Migraines... and then his other book, Adrenaline Dominance: A Revolutionary Approach to Wellness, which is a fascinating, deep dive into adrenaline, which I feel like isn't really discussed that much, and its pivotal role in many health conditions.  

Now, the life changing thing about all of this is not only did reading those books just provide me with a foundational educational approach to hormones that I am so grateful for, but I immediately after reading them ordered Dr. Platt's progesterone cream, switched over to using that. It's been incredible. I'm sure we can talk a little bit about that. But my sister, she has had PMDD, which is basically the really intense form of PMS that is accepted in the medical world as something diagnoseable in a real "disease" or whatever you would call it. She struggled with it for over a decade ever since she's had a menstrual cycle actually. I told her I was like, "Danielle, I think you should try this cream. I think it might actually address your PMDD." She was pretty skeptical, because she's been trying to "fix her PMDD" for years. Like, it honestly makes her life hell. I finally convinced her.  

Within a few weeks, she told me that her PMDD was gone, like just gone. I thought that was going to happen, especially, after reading Dr. Platt's books, but I didn't want to get my hopes up, she didn't want to get her hopes up, so, we're just blown away. Now, every time there's a sale for this cream, I text her and she stocks up. That was a really long intro. But that's just a testimonial to say that this hormone stuff really, really works and not just the progesterone. We're going to talk about adrenaline, and estrogen, and testosterone. So, Dr. Platt, thank you so, so much for being here. You've already changed my life, my sister's life, and I think you're about to change many of my listeners lives. Thank you. So, to start things off, can you tell listeners a little bit about your personal story. You do talk about it in your books, but what led you to the importance of working with hormones with bioidentical hormones with your patients, and what led you to write these books, and everything that you're doing today? 

Michael Platt: The thing that had the most dramatic influence in my life is that, my mother died at the age of 61 of breast cancer. Right after she died, I realized that I had inherited her hormones. Most people do not realize that men and women had the identical hormones, different levels but the same hormone and the reason I said that it is that she had a belly on her. She'd a lot of fat around the waist, but she was thin everywhere else. The only thing that'll put-on fat like that is insulin. I know that every time I used to drive, I would have to slap my face trying to keep my eyes open. So, I think that I actually had increased insulin. The fact that she had breast cancer, I realized that she was low on progesterone. So, I thought well maybe there's a connection between the progesterone and the insulin, and I started using progesterone cream. After I did that, ever since that day, I've never gotten sleepy in a car. So, that really sparked my interest in hormones and so, I started trying to learn everything I could, and so I started Incorporating bio-identical hormones into my practice. 

What's interesting, if you've ever read my books, you'll notice that there are no references in my books. There're no references to other articles, or books, or whatever. The reason for that is that, everything I have learned, I have learned from sitting down talking to my patients, which is actually called observational based medicine as opposed to evidence-based medicine, which I don't believe in any event. But that's how I got started with hormones. I realized after, again, dealing with thousands of patients, I started finding out about adrenaline and how that played a role. We'll talk about that. Adrenaline is a hormone that most people have heard of, but nobody really ever talks about. And yet, it's the underlying cause of many conditions felt to be incurable, like your sister's PMDD. PMDD is premenstrual dysphoric disorder is all about adrenaline. Maybe, right now, your sister can attest to the fact that it is not incurable even a doctor say it is and whatever. So, that's a little background.  

Melanie Avalon: So, you just touched on just in that story of what led up to what you're doing, so many different things affected by specific hormones that people might not anticipate. So, you're talking about how you get sleepy while you're driving, and you talk a lot about the connection there with sleepiness and insulin, and its relation to progesterone. You talked about the location of your mom's fat and how that affected everything. So, all throughout your books, you basically link every single health condition to hormones. So, a question about that, is it chicken or egg with hormones? So, do the hormones go out of whack and then we get these issues or is there something that happens and then the hormones get out of whack? 

Michael Platt: Or both. People need to understand that actually control every system in the body is controlled by hormones. You can readily understand that if hormones go out of whack, then the systems will start going out of whack. As people get older, their hormone levels drop. Except for men, their estradiol level actually goes up while other hormones go down. So, I think it's the hormones going out of whack that have a great effect. But also, I guess, there are certain conditions that can affect hormones, so that would be like the chicken instead of the egg. 

Melanie Avalon: Actually, I'm so glad you said that about the hormone levels dropping with age, and then how it's affected in gender. This is a question that haunts me. So, like menopause for example, the fact that our hormones naturally or women-- like whatever hormones drop in women and men, whatever hormones raise, what do you think is the evolutionary purpose there? Why do we stop making hormones if we need them so bad? Why does that happen? Then is it natural to bring them back if the body is naturally dropping them off anyways? 

Michael Platt: It's an excellent question. I think humans probably were not supposed to live as long as they do live and hormones are strictly genetic. In other words, you inherit hormones from both parents. I don't think we're supposed to be living as long as we do and that's why the hormone levels drop off. I'm not sure. I'll be honest with you. But in terms of replacing them, it all comes down to what's called the quality of life. If somebody's hormones are out of balance, rating some physical issues, then it's worthwhile to replace hormones. The question more comes up about things like growth hormone, whether that should be replaced and I'm not sure. Some people feel that growth hormone speeds up the aging process. So, what's nice about something like progesterone cream, which happens to be my favorite hormone, there's no downside to it. Because it blocks the three most toxic hormones in the body, you can see that it provides many benefits. Maybe, your listeners will see. 

Melanie Avalon: The episode I aired this week was with Dr. Valter Longo, he's a fasting researcher at USC. We talked about this menopause question and he said the exact same thing that you just said, basically that maybe we weren't meant to live as long, and so, these hormones naturally drop off because we're just not meant to live as long as far as the reproduction and everything that happens with that. Okay, so, progesterone. Because there's so many ways we could go with this conversation. But what is progesterone? You just said that it blocks the three toxic hormones. What would those be? So, what is the role of progesterone in the body? 

Michael Platt: Well, most people think of progesterone as a hormone that blocks estrogen and it does. And thing about estrogen and specifically estradiol, to me, it is a very toxic hormone. The reason I say that, it is the reason why women get cramps, and PMS, and breast tenderness with their periods, but it also causes fibroids, and endometriosis, and polycystic ovaries, and it causes gallbladder disease, and asthma, and migraine headaches, and lupus, and rheumatoid arthritis. It causes blood clots and also it causes six different cancers. So, to me, estradiol is a very toxic hormone and progesterone is the hormone that blocks estradiol. Then the other, insulin, you can't live without insulin. But Insulin is a hormone that it raises blood pressure, and it also is a hormone that speeds up the aging process. Then the other hormone that progesterone blocks is adrenaline, which is an important hormone, especially, if you're in danger. But that's a rare incident. And we'll go into the problems related to excess adrenaline, but it can be considered a very toxic hormone.  

The other thing is what I should mention is that all hormones are made with cholesterol. Not surprising, they find that women with the highest cholesterol levels have the greatest longevity, and yet, the number one selling drug are statin drugs to lower cholesterol. This is in spite of the fact that 75% of people that have heart attacks have it with low cholesterol. I have to be honest with you, I'm not a big fan of our medical system, and especially Big Pharma. But I just wanted to reassure those people in your audience that have a high cholesterol. When I was in medical school, a normal cholesterol was 300. They had much less heart disease then. But when they came out with a statin drug, they couldn't get enough people on the drug. So, the drug companies lowered the upper limits of normal. Not the medical system but the drug companies decided what was normal. So, they immediately put it down to 260 and millions of people had to get on the drugs. They actually got the normal level down to 160 because they wanted to put children on these drugs. We can talk about cholesterol later, but I just wanted to mention this because you brought up longevity.  

Melanie Avalon: See, that is fascinating because normally, I feel like it's the opposite and that a lot of the conventional ranges are, well, it's not really the opposite. But a lot of the conventional ranges are raised to adapt to a sicker population like raising the HbA1c or something like that. But wow, the fact that cholesterol, that's a huge change from 300 down to 160. That's really concerning. Two questions about that. One is, so we know when you were in medical school and it was a higher upper limit. Do you think it even matters like the HDL, the triglyceride ratios or like those type of factors, do you think there's been change with that, or do you think the ratios are more important, or do you think it's about the numbers? 

Michael Platt: Well, HDL is probably important because it does help prevent coronary artery disease. What's interesting about cholesterol is that the one thing I mentioned is that high levels are not necessarily bad things to have. But the other thing is, again, when I was doing my training, they used to call cholesterol the poor man's thyroid test. The reason for that is that the thyroid controls cholesterol metabolism. If somebody does have a problem with elevated cholesterol, primary approach should be to just put them on thyroid rather than put them on a statin drug, which has so many side effects. Brain damage, memory loss, permanent nerve damage, irreversible kidney failure, heart damage, sudden death. I mean these are all side effects of the statin drugs which actually have very little benefit. 

Melanie Avalon: So, people with lower cholesterol levels, is that enough cholesterol to make all the hormones that you need? Where does the danger start with too low cholesterol and just not having enough raw materials to make hormones? 

Michael Platt: I would say anything cholesterol level below 160 would be a concern. The ideal cholesterol level for a woman is 239. And yet, the doctors consider anything above 200 is being high. 

Melanie Avalon: The other ones you were talking about estrogen, insulin. So, this was an interesting concept. I had not read this before but you discuss how progesterone actually antagonizes insulin. Could you talk a little bit about that?  

Michael Platt: A lot of people get sleepy between three and four in the afternoon and the reason for that is that's when insulin levels peak. Again, a number of people get sleepy when they're driving, which is also a low blood sugar. What's nice about progesterone and some people get sleepy right after eating because as soon as you put food in your mouth, the body's putting out insulin. So, the thing about progesterone is that, it blocks insulin. So, it prevents people from getting sleepy after eating, it prevents people from getting sleepy in the afternoon, and it prevents people from getting sleepy when they're driving. This is not actually a known benefit of progesterone. But now, your listeners will know that it is one of the benefits. That's why when it comes to using progesterone, I very often recommend using it before meals as another way of actually controlling adrenaline. The reason for that is that-- and we'll discuss this later, but the reason why the body puts out adrenaline is to raise sugar levels to the brain. One of the ways of keeping adrenaline manageable is to prevent low blood sugars after eating. That's what progesterone does.  

Melanie Avalon: So that sleepiness with the low blood sugar, my confusion is do some people it just stays low and they get sleepy, where some people adrenaline kicks in, and then raises it, and then they get alert again, like, does adrenaline always jump in and help out with that? 

Michael Platt: Always, yes. When a person is driving and they're getting really sleepy and [laughs] I donā€™t stop, as I said I would just slap my face, it actually takes about five or 10 minutes for the body to release adrenaline and bring sugar levels back up. That's a long five or 10 minutes when you try not to go off the road. Yeah. So, there is a timeframe involved. If somebody gets sleepy in the afternoon, again, adrenaline will kick in. So, they'll wake up again. Yeah, so, there is a timeframe involved. 

Melanie Avalon: What is though its actual purpose, like, why do we have progesterone? 

Michael Platt: Interesting question. I think primarily, it's a women's hormone, even though, it's not. Men and women as I said have the same hormones. But it's a hormone that its main function actually in women is to get the uterus ready for pregnancy. That's why it's called progestational or and women very often find that once they start using progesterone, if they're still menstruating that they'll actually have heavier periods and might maybe even spotting. This is because what it's doing, it's actually healing the uterus and it's a temporary phenomenon. Those kind of side effects go away. But like I say, a woman cannot have a successful pregnancy without progesterone. The number one reason why women have trouble conceiving is a low progesterone, the number one reason why women have miscarriages is a low progesterone. So, again, in terms of conception, it's incredibly important hormone. But what's not appreciated is its effect on other hormones other than estrogen. 

Melanie Avalon: So, when I started using your cream, I started spotting. When my sister started using it with the PMDD, it actually delayed her cycle. It was funny because I don't know if she wants me to share this, but she texted me and she was like, "Can it delay your cycle?" I was like, "It probably can change things around a little bit." She was like, "Okay. She is like my PMDD is either gone because of this cream or my cycles delayed and I'm pregnant." I was like, "Oh, well, we'll find out pretty soon." It was the cream, by the way. So, questions about supplementing progesterone. You've mentioned how it naturally drops with menopause, and how no side effects, and how it can bring all these benefits. I mean, because reading your books, it just seems to be the miracle hormone that can do so many things, address so many conditions. Does supplementing with it, is there a feedback loop? Does that down regulate our natural production, can we over supplement, are there side effects? 

Michael Platt: Well, in general, you cannot overdose on progesterone. You can actually use it through. Like 30 times a day, you'll run out of it but you won't overdose on it. There's no such thing as a progesterone stimulating hormone. So, using progesterone will not lower a woman or man from making progesterone. You're familiar with PCOS, polycystic ovary syndrome? And again, the cause of that is a low progesterone. What happens is that the pituitary senses the progesterone levels are low, but the problem is there's no such thing as a progesterone stimulating hormone. So, it just sends out a generic stimulus to the ovaries to make more hormones. So, what happens is the ovaries cannot make more progesterone but the stimulus makes them produce more testosterone and more estrogen. Women get all the symptoms of problems related to PCOS, in terms of unwanted hair growth, and acne, and cramps, and whatever.  

But unfortunately, the progesterone level stays low. So, the treatment of course of polycystic ovary syndrome should be to get progesterone. Once the levels go up, then the pituitary will stop sending out those other stimuli and the testosterone level goes down, the estradiol level goes down. But most women with PCOS issue with birth control pills which actually prevent them from making progesterone. Doctors get no training in hormones. The reason for this again is that doctors are not trained to treat the cause of illness. Basically, our whole medical system is again controlled by drug companies who thrive on disease and illness. So, the less doctors know the better for the drug companies anyway. 

Melanie Avalon: So, with the PCOS thing, I also had Dr. Benjamin Bikman on the show, and we talked about PCOS, and he was positing that high insulin is the cause of PCOS. If you're saying that progesterone lowers insulin or antagonizes insulin, that whole narrative would go together. Would there being no stimulating signal for progesterone? Is that unique in the different hormones, do the other hormones have an individual signal, or is it always just a signal to create hormones in general? 

Michael Platt: Well, no, it's not specific to progesterone, but it is important to understand that. Insulin resistance is considered heart of PCOS. That doctor was correct. But I don't believe it's the reason why women have PCOS. I think the insulin resistance is more related to the progesterone situation. 

Melanie Avalon: It's like the analogy I'm thinking of, I don't know if this is an appropriate analogy, but it's like omega-3. So, people, we might see all these benefits to omega-3s, and a lot of people might eat massive doses of farmed salmon, when really you're not going to get concentrated high dose of omega-3 and farmed salmon, you're also going to get high omega-6 and saturated fat. The alternative would be to just take like krill oil or get the pure omega-3. Maybe that's a similar comparison. So, estrogen, estrogen is actually often prescribed though in conventional medicine for various health conditions as our synthetic versions of progesterone. So, what are your thoughts on current conventional system and how it prescribes hormones and hormone replacement? 

Michael Platt: People may have heard the term bioidentical hormone. Now, bioidentical means that the hormones that are being prescribed are identical to the hormones that the body produces. Now, why this is important is that, the way hormones work is that they attach to hormone receptor sites on different cells. The only hormones that get really attached to these receptor sites are the bioidentical ones. So, you can always get more of an effective type response using hormones that the body recognizes rather than the synthetic ones, which are the ones that we generally use. The problem with those kinds of hormones that you're mentioning is that, they prevent women from ovulating. The only type of birth control that I ever recommend is a what's called a copper 7 IUD, which is non-hormonal. So, it doesn't affect the woman's hormone. Yeah, I'm not a big fan of birth control pill. [laughs] Anything that prevents the body from making progesterone, I don't recommend. 

Melanie Avalon: I was telling my mom because she has a lot of hormonal issues and things that she struggles with and I'm trying to turn everybody on to your cream. So, I was trying to convince her to take your cream, but she had been told that she needed estrogen because her estrogen levels were low. So, I think that's a dialogue that's happening a lot between patients and doctors. Do you think there's ever a time for supplementing estrogen?  

Michael Platt: Well, remember, estrogen over estradiol to me is very toxic hormone. The only reason why a woman needs a high level of estrogen is if she's trying to get pregnant. That's the only benefit of a high level of estrogen. Now, when it comes to estrogen, there are basically three different types of natural estrogen. There's estradiol, there's estrone, there's estriol. The only estrogen that I recommend is estriol and the reason for that, it's the only estrogen that doesn't cause cancer. In fact, it's so safe they've used it to treat breast cancer because it takes up estrogen receptor sites in breast cancer cells and prevents the stronger estrogens from attaching. But also, estriol's only estrogen that is effective for vaginal dryness, which sometimes is a problem for women after menopause. Yeah, so, there are ways of resupplying estrogen that will help the skin, and hair, and whatever without giving them the toxic effects of estradiol. Estradiol is the most common estrogen that is replaced after the menopause. 

Melanie Avalon: The one that you like is the one that's commonly prescribed? 

Michael Platt: No, no. Not the one that I like is not commonly prescribed.  

Melanie Avalon: So, estradiol is normally prescribed, but you like estriol?  

Michael Platt: Yes, correct.  

Melanie Avalon: Okay. Is estriol even available as like a pharmaceutical prescription? 

Michael Platt: Well, it's available by prescription, it's also available over the counter. We have a therapeutic strength of estriol on the website. 

Melanie Avalon: Say a person is-- which I feel like this is probably a rare case, because after reading your book and just from what I've seen, it seems like estrogen dominance seems to more often be the issue than low estrogen, but if a person was low estrogen and they supplemented progesterone for example, what would happen in that case? 

Michael Platt: Well, it's not going to harm them at all. Yeah, progesterone is safe whether you have estrogen or you did not take the estrogen because of so many benefits. You can't harm anybody with progesterone.  

Melanie Avalon: You talk in the books about how there are progesterone sites all over the body. So, people might experience different effects based on the receptor sites. So, I was wondering for you to talk a little bit about that. 

Michael Platt: Now, are you talking in terms of side effects, are you talking in terms of just effects in general?  

Melanie Avalon: Both. 

Michael Platt: Okay. In terms of side effects, there are a lot of progesterone receptor sites around the nipple area. So, some women may experience some tenderness around the nipples when they first start using progesterone. This is again a temporary phenomenon that goes away. But aside from that, the only other side effect you can make was something called type 3 diabetes.  

Melanie Avalon: Yes.  

Michael Platt: And for your listeners, type 3 diabetes is another term for insulin resistance in the brain. What that means is that, the insulin in the brain has a real hard time getting glucose into the brain cell. Why it's important to have knowledge of this is that, it's probably the number one precursor to Alzheimer's. The thing about Alzheimer's, it is really a disease of prevention. So, progesterone, one of the benefits is that, it does create some degree of insulin resistance, which is why it prevents people from getting sleepy when they're driving, or sleepy in the afternoon, or sleepy after eating. But if somebody already has insulin resistance in the brain and uses progesterone, it will increase the insulin resistance and make it even harder to get the glucose into the brain cell.  

As a result, the body immediately starts producing, sending out extra adrenaline to raise sugar levels for the brain. So, people that have type 3 diabetes or insulin resistance to the brain, once as soon as they put on progesterone, they'll have an immediate outpouring of adrenaline, and so, they get palpitations, or a lot of muscle tension, or anger and whatever. That is actually the only side effect of progesterone. It only happens in people that have bad condition. But the benefit is that there's no way of testing for type 3 diabetes. There's no test for it. But the actual test for it is using progesterone. If they get that reaction, then people can be alerted to it. Once you know that you have insulin resistance in the brain, there are things you can do to prevent the onset of Alzheimer's. It's actually a good side effect or a beneficial one because you can diagnose a condition that has no test for. 

Melanie Avalon: So, if you take the progesterone cream and you get like anger, and palpitations, and that response, it might be a sign that you are in the type 3 diabetes world. That's fascinating. The normal response to progesterone, I touched on it earlier, like I originally was taking oral progesterone, and I was talking with one of my nurse practitioner friends recently, and she was talking about taking oral progesterone. But you talk in the book about the potential downsides of oral progesterone and how it can be converted in the liver to other hormones. So, what is the difference in people taking oral progesterone versus a cream? 

Michael Platt: Because the progesterone is taken orally, it actually passes through the liver before it gets into the general circulation. Once again, once oral progesterone gets to deliver, it converts it into another hormone called allopregnanolone. Allopregnanolone is not progesterone. One of its major side effects, it makes people very sleepy. This is why it's usually prescribed at night. But people should understand this is not progesterone. The difference is that, when people use a cream, we should consider like a transdermal type administration, is that the cream goes directly into the bloodstream and bypasses the liver. So, it goes to all the receptor sites before it goes to the liver. Doctors, again, received no training and especially, when it comes to hormone. So, they're not aware that oral progesterone should never be used. 

Melanie Avalon: When you put it on transdermally, does it go to receptor sites close to where you put it on or does it have a systemic effect? 

Michael Platt: Oh, it's completely systemic. Even though, you've put it on the arm, most of progesterone eventually winds up in the brain actually. When the fetus is in the womb by the way, it's progesterone that actually helps the brain to develop. When the fetus is in the womb, it gets exposed to incredibly high levels of progesterone, incredibly high level. I mean, levels that cannot be duplicated. So, while we're talking about this, some women have a fetus that does a lot of kicking. Those fetuses that do a lot of kicking, that's adrenaline by the way. These are usually the babies that when they're born will have colic, and colic is strictly caused by adrenaline. What's nice about progesterone is that, you rub it on the baby's belly and colic goes away in about three minutes. So, you don't have to stay up all night with a crying baby. Again, giving progesterone to a baby is exceedingly safe because when the baby was in the womb, it got exposed to incredibly high levels of progesterone. 

Melanie Avalon: Do hormones cross the blood-brain barrier, then?  

Michael Platt: Well, yeah, they do.  

Melanie Avalon: Okay and how about their effects. For listeners, supplementing the progesterone cream is the protocol to put it a thin skin area, can you put it on the same area multiple times, do you need to switch around sites, how does that work? 

Michael Platt: Yeah, most people that provide progesterone recommend rotating sites. I don't. Probably, the most easily accessible place is to apply the progesterone to the forearm, and you rub the two forearms together. Now, what I do recommend is that every so often, that people scrub their forearms with a loofah sponge, and what that does is it gets the cream out of the pores. Now you don't have to worry about the receptor sites because again, the cream goes directly into the bloodstream and goes all over the body to the receptor site. So, you don't have to rotate. But it is recommended that every once in a while to just scrub the arms just to get the cream out of the pores and I'll talk more about dosage when we talk about adrenaline.  

Melanie Avalon: This is a random question, are hormones created in both for women like the ovaries and the pituitary- 

Michael Platt: And the adrenal gland. 

Melanie Avalon: -and the adrenal glands. So, is there any difference in the actual hormone? Does it matter at all where they were produced from or not? 

Michael Platt: Where they're produced from is not important because again, different hormones are like, fat cells produce estrogen. So, it doesn't matter where they're produced. They'll be the same hormone. 

Melanie Avalon: I'm so fascinated by fat cells and how basically, once you start heading down the road of accumulating "unhealthy excess fat" that is producing estrogen, I mean, it's just like a self-perpetuating problem because I'm guessing. Because then it tells us, does it release hormones, release estrogen and encourage even more fat accumulation? 

Michael Platt: That's an interesting question. I don't know why fat cells would release estrogen, but the estrogen probably does get into the bloodstream. Think about estrogen. It's what they call a lipogenic hormone, which means it creates fat, and it puts on fat, usually around the hips, thighs, and buttocks. So, it's where cellulite comes from, it's from estrogen. Progesterone, on the other hand is a thermogenic hormone. It helps the body to burn fat. But the thing about progesterone is that you don't want to put it over fat cells, because when you put it over fat cells, it can actually increase fat.  

Melanie Avalon: Oh, it can?  

Michael Platt: Yeah. So, that's why applying it to areas of the body where the skin is thin is better. 

Melanie Avalon: Oh, interesting. Do you know why it would increase fat?  

Michael Platt: That's a rabbinical question. 

Melanie Avalon: Oh, what question?  

Michael Platt: Of course, you have to ask the rabbis because they know. 

Melanie Avalon: Oh. Okay. [laughs] 

Michael Platt: They've an answer to everything. 

Melanie Avalon: Okay. I'll write that down on my to-do list. Okay, so, we keep teasing adrenaline. So, your book, Adrenaline Dominance is fascinating. Especially, you provide a really, really fascinating approach to something a lot of people and maybe even more than we think struggle with and that is ADHD. So, I was wondering if you could talk a little bit about adrenaline. Really quick question, is adrenaline a pseudonym for epinephrine or are those different? 

Michael Platt: They are both the same.  

Melanie Avalon: Okay. So, what is adrenaline, what have you discovered and its connection to ADHD and different types of ADHD? 

Michael Platt: Well, adrenaline is actually a hormone as well as a neurotransmitter. It's both. It affects the body differently, whether it's the hormone or the neurotransmitter that's being effective. The thing about ADHD, there're a lot of misconceptions and misinformation about ADHD. But what people don't realize is that, the most intelligent, successful creative people in the world have ADHD. Just about all doctors and lawyers have ADHD. The thing about adrenaline is that, adrenaline is a neurotransmitter is what gives people intelligence. So, most intelligent people will have increased adrenaline. People that have the most adrenaline are creative type people actually, and we'll talk about that. But when it comes to ADHD, what people may fail to realize, it's not a learning disorder. It's an interest disorder. People with ADHD have no trouble focusing on things they're interested in. If they're not interested, they have a hard time focusing. The reason for that is that the adrenaline, again, as a neurotransmitter speeds up the mind. So, this is why people with lot of adrenaline very often talk very quickly.  

But if somebody with a lot of adrenaline, if they're not interested, they get distracted very easily. But actually, and if a child has ADHD, that means that one or both parents have ADHD because it's always genetic, always. You can actually eliminate ADHD within 24 hours just by lowering adrenaline. They put kids on drugs like Ritalin, Strattera, Adderall, and these drugs all have side effects like sudden death. If a child doesn't have ADHD and you put them on one of these drugs, the drugs will give them ADHD. The reason for that they're strictly-- they're pure adrenaline. These drugs are all stimulant. That's why a lot of kids don't like it because it numbs their brain is what does. 

Melanie Avalon: The conventional ADHD drugs are adrenaline? Even though, we're just saying how adrenaline, high adrenaline is the cause, so, if it does help a person, a kid, how is it helping? 

Michael Platt: For whatever reason, it may actually be causing a drop in the body's own production of adrenaline. But I know that they numb the brain, which  I guess is to focus better. They don't feel good on these drugs which is understandable. 

Melanie Avalon: Well, it's so interesting. So, speaking to what you were just talking about the focus issue and the interest issue being a thing, so, I read your books, and I had this new view of it. I was talking with my friend and she's saying that her son, they were trying to tell her that he had ADHD and she was saying that he can focus. He can focus if he really likes doing it. She's like, "He just doesn't like focusing if he doesn't like what they're trying to get him to focus on." I was just like, "Oh, that's what Dr. Platt said in his book." So, for a child and maybe we can talk about adults, too, with ADHD, you said the answer is lowering adrenaline cannot be done through supplementing progesterone with children? 

Michael Platt: Well, yeah. Progesterone, remember, it blocks adrenaline. But the primary approach to dealing with people that have increased adrenaline is actually to treat the reason why the body is putting out adrenaline. By the way, I should mention, I had classic ADHD when I was-- I used to get up and walk out of class. I couldn't focus at all at school. It wasn't until I got into medical school that I started studying. Because I was interested in medicine, but there was nothing in high school or college I had any interest in. So, I can relate to these kids that have trouble focusing. What happen is, you just wait till the night before the exam to study. Because the adrenaline provides intelligence, you can pass your test, you don't learn anything, but you get . 

Melanie Avalon: So, how do we lower the adrenaline? 

Michael Platt: Well, what makes it relatively simple is that there's only basically two reasons why the body puts out adrenaline. One is if you're in danger. They call it the fight or flight hormone. But danger is a real-- it's a very unusual, it's not a very common reason why the body can send adrenaline. What people do not appreciate or realize is that the main function of adrenaline is to provide glucose, sugar to the brain. Again, what people don't realize is that the brain actually uses more sugar than any other tissue in the body [unintelligible [00:39:15] and anytime the body detects that the brain is running out of glucose, it automatically puts out adrenaline to raise glucose levels. Now, what this infers is that, the way to approach problems with increased adrenaline is just to provide the brain with the fuel that it needs so the body doesn't have to use adrenaline to provide the fuel. That's the whole premise behind treating problems related excess adrenaline is get the brain the fuel that it needs. 

Now, the brain uses two different fuels. I mentioned glucose and the best source of glucose for the brain actually comes from vegetable. Now, you don't think of glucose as being a great source of sugar. Actually, you don't think of vegetables to be a great source of sugar but they are carbohydrate and all carbohydrates break down into sugar. I'm sorry. So, we're talking about vegetables. What's good about vegetables is that, they're low glycemic for the most part. Low glycemic means they don't produce a lot of insulin. Candy and soda are great sources of glucose but they're high glycemic. They produce a lot of insulin, which actually lowers sugar and defeat the purpose. Green vegetables are almost zero glycemic. They produce very little insulin. So, that's why vegetables are a good source of glucose for the brain. 

Now, the other fuel, which are probably more important are ketones. Most people have heard of what they call a ketogenic diet, which I don't recommend only because it's a very difficult diet to accomplish. But you can get ketones directly from coconut oil or something called MCT oil. MCT, medium chain triglyceride oil, which is derived from coconut oil. The coconut oil is best used for cooking because it has some very high heat threshold and MCT oil has no flavor. So, it could be added to anything. Many people have heard of bulletproof coffee, which has MCT oil in it. So, if people are providing fuel to the brain throughout the day, now keep in mind that the brain can use up fuel as quickly as three hours. So, throughout the day, some form of vegetables, some MCT or coconut oil, and especially before going to sleep and eating something before going to sleep and the reason for them is that adrenaline peaks at 2:30 in the morning. This is because the brain runs out of fuel right around 2:30 in the morning. A lot of people wake up at that time to urinate because adrenaline give people that urge to urinate.  

Some women have what they call an overactive bladder. When they have to go, they have to go and they're running to the bathroom and some women lose urine while they're running bathroom. They call it the urgency incontinence. But an overactive bladder is strictly adrenaline and again, very easy to [unintelligible [00:42:05]. So, people can wake up at 2:30 in the morning and get that urge to urinate. So, that's why it's important to eat something before going to sleep. Where progesterone cream comes in is that it helps to block adrenaline and it blocks insulin. So, that's why I advise using progesterone before people eat, and especially, before going to sleep, and to help control insulin, and helping control insulin is another way of controlling adrenaline because it prevents that hyperglycemia. 

Melanie Avalon: When you're using the progesterone to control insulin before eating, how long does that effect last in the bloodstream where it's affecting insulin? 

Michael Platt: Well, progesterone is in the bloodstream for only about five or six minutes. But it attaches to receptor site and remember that's how hormones do what they do. So, the effect of progesterone could last for hours actually. 

Melanie Avalon: Okay. The effect on the insulin. 

Michael Platt: On insulin, and adrenaline, and estrogen, yes. 

Melanie Avalon: With the adrenaline because I think when people think adrenaline, they think stress hormone. What is its relation to cortisol? Do they go hand in hand, are they completely separate? 

Michael Platt: Well, no, they do go hand in hand. Adrenaline is a stress hormone. When people have stress, they have a lot of adrenaline. Now, what's interesting is that, I mentioned that adrenaline peaks around 2:30 in the morning, and remember that the reason why body is releasing adrenaline is to raise sugar level. A lot of people are concerned about weight. When people are either eating sugar or the body is making sugar, if you don't burn it up, then the body takes that sugar and stores it in fat cells and gets converted into fat. Now, when the body releases adrenaline, it creates stress to the body. The body responds to stress by putting out cortisol. The first thing cortisol does is it also raises the sugar level. Now, adrenaline does it by a process called gluconeogenesis, where it converts protein into sugar. The thing about cortisol, it raises sugar through another process called glycogenolysis, where it converts glycogen into glucose. But the point is that, while people are lying in bed, now they're putting out two hormones that both raise sugar levels. I am 100% convinced that this is the number one cause of weight gain.  

When people are trying to lose weight, they don't realize that most of the weight is coming on while they're sleeping and trying to sleep. So, I just want to mention that. So, cortisol, again, it's not a happy hormone. It can cause us osteoporosis, it causes weight gain, it damages the immune system. So, they have a condition called adrenal fatigue, which your people may have heard of. Adrenal fatigue, it's a naturopath diagnosis. The reason why they are the ones that diagnose adrenal fatigue is that, they do saliva test on hormone. The thing about adrenaline, adrenaline is a survival hormone. As part of the survival response, it cuts off blood supply to areas of the body that are not needed for survival. When people experience cold hands and cold feet, that's not a low thyroid, that's adrenaline. It also cuts off blood supply to the intestines because they're not needed for survival. That's what constipation and irritable bowel syndrome comes from.  

It cuts off blood supply to the salivary glands because they're not needed to survive. So, the hormones don't get into the saliva. So, when they do a saliva test, they find low cortisol levels in the morning when they should be high. Based on the low cortisol levels on a saliva test, they diagnose adrenal fatigue and their whole approach to adrenal fatigue is to raise cortisol level when they're already high to begin with. I just want people to know that adrenal fatigue is a non-existent condition. That's why I never ever recommend saliva tests for hormone. It just never makes sense. Yeah, so cortisol, again, just like adrenaline is not a happy hormone. 

Melanie Avalon: I mean, that's a paradigm shift right there because definitely the term adrenal fatigue is casually thrown around all the time in the health circles, so the adrenal glands, do they ever become fatigued? Do they ever stop producing hormones? 

Michael Platt: There's a thing called adrenal insufficiency where the adrenal glands don't produce hormones. This is not related to it and that's not adrenal fatigue. That's adrenal insufficiency. Another term for it would be Addison's disease. That's a serious condition that needs to be treated with hormones. But again, if anything, adrenal glands don't become fatigued, they become again overactive, and they can actually hypertrophy, get larger. 

Melanie Avalon: This is a super random granular question, but so, you were talking about people on lower carb diets or ketogenic diets. So, in a stress state with adrenaline and cortisol trying to raise blood sugar levels, would it matter at all if you were glycogen depleted? So, if you were following a low carb diet and say your glycogen stores were depleted, if cortisol works by glycogenolysis, would a low carb state mean that adrenaline is the preferred hormone for raising blood sugar levels or does the diet you're following and your glycogen stores not really even relate to that? 

Michael Platt: I don't know if that's an actual-- I personally have never run into a problem that I was aware of that was happening, what you're talking about logically makes sense that maybe there could be an issue with that. But again, since I don't deal with  low-carb diet, maybe that's why I haven't run into an issue with it. 

Melanie Avalon: So, with the MCT oil, are you concerned at all about energy toxicity? If people are having a carb rich diet, but then also bringing in the substrate of ketones or does it work pretty well for your patients? 

Michael Platt: Well, everybody's different. For example, some people do a lot of exercise. When people are using their muscles, their muscles are burning glucose also, just like the brain burns glucose. So, sometimes, diets have to be adjusted to make sure they're getting enough carbohydrates. But it's not that complicated it just makes somebody have two, three, four tablespoons of coconut oil or MCT oil per day, and it'd be at least in the beginning, and eat some form of vegetable throughout the day, and use a progesterone cream. In 24 hours, there'll be a dramatic change. Twenty-four hours is all it takes. People that have road rage from adrenaline can get rid of it in 24 hours. Bedwetting in children is only caused by excess adrenaline and you'll only see that in creative type children. Again, because I mentioned creative people had the most adrenaline, but you can get rid of bedwetting in 24 hours. So, yeah, I like simple, I like easy, I don't like complicated.  

Melanie Avalon: I was actually talking to you about this offline, but what about vegan diets? Can they support healthy hormone production?  

Michael Platt: Yeah, absolutely. The only thing vegans have to be concerned about is vitamin B12. It's only found in meat. So, that should be added to their meal plan. Yeah, vegan diets are actually perfect because they provide the glucose. 

Melanie Avalon: Is low cholesterol an issue if somebody is following a vegan diet or a low-fat plant-based vegan diet, will they have sufficient cholesterol to make their hormones? 

Michael Platt: That's an interesting question. Fat is not the enemy, even though, we've made it the enemy. But it's not the enemy. Fat is the only food substances that doesn't stimulate insulin production. Insulin is what creates fat around the middle. So, ever since medicine took over weight issues, we've had an epidemic of obesity because they put everybody on low-carb diet. 

Melanie Avalon: Or, low-fat diets?  

Michael Platt: And both. Yeah.  

Melanie Avalon: Oh, a low carb as well.  

Michael Platt: Yeah.  

Melanie Avalon: Oh, so you think low carb is creating an issue?  

Michael Platt: Oh, well, actually, more importantly, the low-fat diet had created a lot more problem. 

Melanie Avalon: I don't know if there's like a word for it but I've heard there's a critical window of I think progesterone supplementation like or maybe it's just bioidentical hormones in general. Like a certain age where if you supplement during that age, then it will have beneficial effects. But if you don't, then it might not be beneficial later. Do you know what I'm talking about? Does this ring a bell?  

Michael Platt: Well, no, I've never heard that.  

Melanie Avalon: Oh, okay. Fail. I'll have to look it up. Yeah, it has something to do with needing to supplement hormones at a certain time, and I think it had to do with how it related to menopause, and then if you did it later that it wouldn't have the same effect. So, I have to circle back on that. Some questions to like bring everything full circle. Why is there all of this controversy in the conventional medical system with supplementing with bioidentical hormones? 

Michael Platt: Well, you have to remember, they didn't know training in hormone. The doctors that have the least knowledge of hormones are actually gynecologists. They are the ones that are supposed to be taking care of women. People don't realize that. But anyway, I guess, there was some concern over that woman's health study, which indicated that combination of estrogen and progestin certainly increase the incidence of breast cancer. That was an honest type concern because they did. I think doctors for the most part are uncomfortable with hormones, because they don't know anything about them. Like I said, if they had no training, some doctors who go for a weekend seminar and think they know about hormones, but I'm just saying that they haven't been trained in hormones. So, that's why they are not comfortable with them. 

Melanie Avalon: Well, just to dispel some of the myths. So, I just want to get super clarity. For example, you sell your cream, so people can just buy that. They don't need a prescription. How is that different from a type of hormone that you would endorse that would be prescribed through a compounding pharmacy and what is the FDA's involvement in all of that? I think there's just a lot of confusion out there about everything. 

Michael Platt: Yeah, again, our hormones are bioidentical and they're not sold under a pharmaceutical license, they're sold under a cosmetic license in terms of the manufacturing. Otherwise, people would need a prescription. Now, the only hormone they will need a prescription for is testosterone and that's a controlled drug. Testosterone, let me tell you. It's an important hormone, especially, not only for men but for women also. The number one cause of death in women is heart attacks and they occur six times more commonly than any other cause of death. When women go through the menopause, they have stopped making testosterone and the heart has more testosterone receptor sites than any other tissue in the body. So, I believe testosterone is important for women after the menopause. They cannot have a libido without testosterone. The only other form they need for libido is progesterone. They need both hormones for libido. But I think the reticence that doctors have when it comes to hormones, they just don't know them or understand them. 

Melanie Avalon: With the testosterone, I learned so much in your book about all of that, especially, well, dispelling two myths. One that, testosterone is thought of as like a male hormone and you don't really think about it for women who may be low, and then on the flipside, progesterone is thought as a female hormone and not often thought of as something that men could benefit from. You did make an interesting point about how regardless of how low a male's testosterone levels are if they have a sex drive, you don't ever prescribe testosterone, is that correct? 

Michael Platt: Let me tell you something. When it comes to hormones, you could never go wrong treating a patient like you can go wrong treating a lab test. So, I feel always more comfortable of treating people rather than lab test. Yeah, so, when it comes to hormone, they provide wellness to people. I remember I had a patient that came in to me, he was 47 years old, and the reason he came to see me is because every morning he would wake up and vomit. The only thing that will cause that kind of vomiting is adrenaline. Needless to say, he also has severe fibromyalgia, which is also caused by excess adrenaline. So, we started talking and I had some progesterone on my desk, and I put some on his forearm, and he rubbed his two arms together, and we continued to talk and about five minutes later, he sat back in his chair and he looked at me and he said, "Doc, in my entire life, I have never felt this way." That's only just after five minutes. Since, he left my office, he never had another episode of vomiting. I guess, the point is that, when you treat the cause of illness, you can provide a real interesting quality of life to people they weren't experiencing and that's very rewarding. Doctors, unfortunately, very rarely see that. Patient says that they've never felt better. But anyway, so, people need to realize, hormones are important.  

Now, when it comes to men, men stop making progesterone right around the age of 50. If you think about it, after that age, when men get into the middle age, they start putting a weight around the middle and that, because they have no progesterone to block insulin, and then they start getting prostate cancer, which is caused by estrogen because they have no longer have progesterone to block estrogen. So, hormone replacement is important, but you have to remember we live in a country where they do not allow preventive medicine. There is no preventive medicine and that's why the United States is on the bottom of list of healthcare of all civilized countries. We have the highest incidence of every known medical condition even including infant mortality, we're at the top of the list. We don't have a good medical system. I'm going to get off my soapbox.  

Melanie Avalon: I cannot agree more as can most likely a lot of my audience and that's a really powerful story that you just shared. I mean, some listeners may be skeptical, but I'm telling you, my sister, I saw it. Something that she struggled with for 10 years and thought she was going to have for the rest of her life, and it's just gone. I think you said in one of your books, you get this question like, is it really that easy and it can be sometimes? 

Michael Platt: It's like fibromyalgia. There are over four million, maybe around eight to 10 million people in this country that have fibromyalgia, which is basically a pain condition. Basically, they've all been told that there's no cure for it. But you can't cure a condition unless you know what's causing the condition. That's the problem is that doctors are not trained to treat the cause of illness. But with fibromyalgia, it only takes three days, and if they're eating well, up to three weeks to get rid of it. So, I don't know.  

Melanie Avalon: So, speaking to that, the lack of knowledge with the doctors and the super importance of treating the patient and not the test results, so, for listeners listening, if they are struggling with you know any one of the numerous conditions that might be linked to that probably is linked to hormonal issues and that might be addressed by progesterone cream for example, is it okay for them to just try, and get the cream, and experiment with themselves or do they need to be working with a practitioner? 

Michael Platt: No, they can't harm themselves with it. Let me explain some symptoms a person might have if they have a lot of adrenaline. First of all, they'll have trouble sleeping. They may have trouble falling asleep, they've been trouble staying asleep. Some people grind their teeth at night. Some people with progressive slave syndrome, that's all adrenaline. When people have a lot of adrenaline, they'll find they're quick to anger and a little short fuse. They might experience cold hands and cold feet, they may carry a lot of tension in the back of the neck, and that muscle tension can cause headaches, and also can cause tinnitus. Tension of the neck from adrenaline is probably the number one cause of tinnitus. When it comes to headaches, a lot of people think they have migraine headaches. But what I have found is that almost 100% of people that I have seen who thought they had migraine headaches actually didn't have migraine headaches. They had a different type of headache called occipital neuritis, which arises from the occipital nerve sheath at the base of the skull, and it causes excruciating headaches. That's why they're always mistaken for migraine and very often the headache shoots right into the back of the eye and they can take their thumb and press into the base of the skull to find a very tender spot that's the occipital nerve sheath. 

But again, it's caused by increased adrenaline causing muscle tension on that nerve sheath and very easy to fix as opposed to migraine headaches, which are not easy to fix. But people also get Botox injection to get rid of occipital neuritis, but they're thinking that they've migraine. But it will be a lot simpler instead of using a toxin or poison. They can just reduce their adrenaline. So, the back of the neck is a real good place for progesterone cream when people have a lot of tension there, the upper shoulder. Normally, it is put on the forearm, you rub the two forearms together. People that have what's called restless legs syndrome, put a pump on the top of each thigh and massage it in, in 30 seconds, the restless legs syndrome will go away. Some people get cramps in their calves or feet. Again, that's also adrenaline. You just have to massage progesterone into the cramp. I mentioned, babies that have colic, you just rub it on their belly and it'll go away in about three minutes. It's just a very safe hormone. 

They have a thing called an overactive bladder in women, again, that's adrenaline. I mentioned they're urge incontinent. So, road rage, and bipolar disorder, and PTSD, it's all adrenaline. Every condition that I've mentioned can be eliminated or greatly benefited by lowering adrenaline. The primary approach lowering adrenaline is to give the brain the fuel that it needs and the progesterone is the icing on the cake as it blocks adrenaline, blocks insulin, and whatever. 

Melanie Avalon: So, the progesterone is systemic but if you have an issue like restless legs or tension headaches, you do benefit more from putting the progesterone closer to that area? 

Michael Platt: Absolutely. Yeah.  

Melanie Avalon: Okay. Very cool. Well, I bet listeners are probably really, really excited to try some of your progesterone cream. So, your website is it plattwellness.com, correct? 

Michael Platt: That's it. Yeah. 

Melanie Avalon: I'm super grateful. So, you have a discount code for my audience and you can use the coupon code, MELANIEAVALON, to get a discount on your purchases. I'm going to be using your progesterone cream for life, probably as well, my sister, and everybody else that I turn onto it. I cannot thank you enough for everything that you're doing. I mean, reading your books like I said was just so eye opening. I honestly wish everyone could read these books and make changes in their own life accordingly. Was there anything else you wanted to touch on that we didn't address? 

Michael Platt: Well, if people do have an issue with excess adrenalin, on my website, they'll also find a meal plan to lower adrenaline if that's helpful for them. 

Melanie Avalon: Oh, awesome. Perfect. Well, so, for listeners, I will put links in the show notes to everything. Again, the show notes will have a transcript, and the links, and that will be at melanieavalon.com/hormones. Thank you so much, Dr. Platt. Well, first of all, thank you. Listeners don't know this but we spent almost an hour before this trying to get connected. So, the most valuable thing I think you can give somebody is your time. So, I, so appreciate your time, everything that you're doing. The last question that I ask every guest on this show and it's just because I realize more and more each day how important mindset is. So, what is something that you're grateful for? 

Michael Platt: I have to mention my wife, who has been tremendously supportive for a lot of stuff that I've gone through and that's about it. Yeah. 

Melanie Avalon: [giggles] I love that. Again, well, thank you so much. I'm so grateful. This was just absolutely amazing and I can't wait to air it. We'll have to stay in touch and yeah, I hope you enjoy the rest of your day.  

Michael Platt: Okay, and tell your sister, she should be on the meal plan. 

Melanie Avalon: I will, I will. I already texted her about all this. I was like, "Well, you got to do this stuff." So. I will tell her right after this. So, thanks, Dr. Platt. 

Michael Platt: My pleasure. Adios. 

Melanie Avalon: Bye. 

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