The Melanie Avalon Biohacking Podcast Episode #319 - Jay Campbell

TRANSCRIPT

Jay Campbell
There are people out there that have compiled data on every person who's ever died of, quote, unquote, SIDS, which is Sudden Infant Death Syndrome, and they can actually correlate it to actually vaccine-related injury. What people have to understand is that all of the diseases of aging, every single one of them, all come from cellular inflammation.

There's no difference between a man and a woman when you hormonally optimize them. The difference is that a man requires a higher amount of testosterone in a woman.

Melanie Avalon
Welcome to the Melanie Avalon Biohacking Podcast, where we meet the world's top experts to explore the secrets of health, mindset, longevity, and so much more. Are you ready to take charge of your existence and biohack your life? This show is for you. Please keep in mind, we're not dispensing medical advice and are not responsible for any outcomes you may experience from implementing the tactics lying herein.

So friends, are you ready to join me? Let's do this. Welcome back to the Melanie Avalon biohacking podcast. Friends, this conversation literally changed my life. It is almost three juicy, incredible hours with Jay Campbell and we dive deep, deep, deep into all things, peptides and hormones. And as I talk about in the episode, I've heard a lot about peptides. I have learned a little bit about them, but I just had not done the deep dive or received the education that I felt I needed to actually take a step into the world of peptides personally. After reading Jay's book and speaking with him, I am shocked I have not done this sooner. I am literally so excited about everything that I learned and I can't wait to start implementing it. I will definitely keep you guys updated. I also would love to hear if you guys have your own experience with peptides and it's not just peptides that we talk about. We talk about so many other things including hormone optimization with hormone replacement therapy. And Jay has some pretty shocking and controversial ideas that I had never heard before. Things how like when men go on testosterone replacement therapy, they should not be on aromatase inhibitors, how their estrogen will actually normalize and also how Jay makes the case that there is no such thing as estrogen dominance. What? You'll learn the best place to put hormonal creams on your body. And yes, it is a very sexy place. We also talk about the ideal body fat percentages, whether or not you can truly be healthy at every size, the complexities of biological age tests and of course all things peptides. Things like GLP1 agonist, including the future of those and one coming out that Jay says is going to be a game changer with no side effects and so many benefits. Also things like BPC157, GHKCU, PT141, I'm learning all these words and so much more. We also talk about a new delivery system for peptides that is coming out, which will make an oral version actually effective. I can't wait to hear what you guys think. Definitely check out Jay's free books. Those are at jaycambold.com slash free books and keep your eyes peeled for an episode with Jay on the intermittent fasting podcast because we didn't even get deep into a topic that I really wanted to discuss with Jay, which is all things burning, stubborn fat, fasting and more. The show notes for today's episode will be at melanieavalon.com slash peptides. Those show notes will have a full transcript as well as links to everything that we talked about. So definitely check that out.

Melanie Avalon
I can't wait to hear what you guys think. Definitely let me know in my Facebook group, I have bio. Intermittent Fasting plus Real Foods plus Life. Comment something you learned or something that resonated with you on the pinned post to enter to win something that I love. And then check out my Instagram, find the Friday announcement post. And again, comment there to enter to win something that I love. All right, I think that's all the things.

Without further ado, please enjoy this fabulous conversation with Jay Campbell. Hi friends, welcome back to the show. I am so incredibly excited about the conversation I'm about to have. It is about a hot topic that I have received so many questions about. I personally have a lot of interest in and I have not done an episode on this topic. In fact, I haven't even, now that I think about it, this hasn't even really come up in many episodes, maybe briefly tangentially, which is kind of wild, the backstory on today's conversation. So a while ago now, I was connected via email to a fabulous human, Jay Campbell, who is renowned in the world of fitness and peptides and hormone optimization and all the things. And so we were discussing doing a podcast together. And then I actually got to meet him in real life, which is crazy at the Biohacker self premiere in Vegas. I was one of like six red carpet hosts and he just happened to be on my list of guests, which was so perfect. So we locked down the details then, we're having the episode now, and we've realized that we've crossed paths like all the time, we come from similar places. And we were both at Dave Asprey's Biohacking Conference last year. So in any case, I was really excited and honored to have this conversation. And then I read, so Jay has a lot of books. The one I read was optimize your health with therapeutic peptides, extend your life by becoming more muscular, leaner, smarter, injury-free and younger. Friends, this was the perfect introduction for me. Well, introduction, I guess, education for me on peptides. My personal history with peptides is, I'm very fascinated by them. I feel like they went from being a little bit fringe to now everybody's talking about them, but, and I'm sure we'll talk about this, I think a lot of people find them not very approachable because of how they are acquired, administered, plus all the confusion about all the different types. So me personally, I actually, I've only done them, used them, I guess, once, and I'm not even sure if I experienced anything from it. And then I do have some like oral ones that I have not used. And I know we're going to talk about administration methods and whether or not that works, but I'm going on rabbit holes. In any case, Jay Campbell is an absolute legend in this field. Just look up his stuff and you'll see all of the incredible things that he's doing. It's really, really inspiring. So I have so many questions. Jay, thank you so much for being here.

Jay Campbell
that's an amazing introduction. It's going to be hard for me to follow, but I'm grateful, a humbled privilege and appreciative of you and everything you just said.

Like you said, it was awesome meeting you in person. This podcast is going to be amazing because you have prepared so many incredible topics and questions for me. So this might be very truthfully one of the best podcasts I've ever done, because if you ask just half of these questions, the public is going to be getting a real treat.

Melanie Avalon
Oh my goodness. Okay. Well, I have to be honest. So okay.

So I do so many episodes on the show and a lot of it's biohacking, obviously. I'm very much familiar. Like I speak the language of biohacking. Like when I read books, I usually feel like I'm in territory where I know what it's talking about and like, you know, AMPK and like mTOR and all these words, like I'm good with reading your book. There are so many peptides and they all have these crazy names. And I was like, oh my goodness, this is a whole new language. I don't speak it. So, um, but I'm so excited for this. So to start things off, actually, just really briefly, your, your personal story, because you're a men's physique champion, you walk the, I always forget the phrase, you walk the walk. You don't just talk the talk, you walk the walk. Were you always into bodybuilding, men's physique, all of those things? Like growing up, was that your,

Jay Campbell
No, so it's a great question. So I'm the oldest of nine kids. So I was always really whoa, whoa. Yeah.

My mom actually gave birth to 10 and he that his name was Christopher J. And he died of SIDS, which if you know anything about SIDS, it's actually a vaccine injury. And so I believe that I can't I don't believe I know I came out as like an avenging anti-vax. That would kill me on this show instantly. But like, I mean, literally, I'm not kidding you, like, at an early age, when I was 22 years old, this is a quick, quick side story, or 23 years old, and I just moved to Los Angeles upon graduating from college, I was playing in a men's basketball league or not men's basketball league, but just pick up. And I ran into a guy who was a chiropractor who was playing, he was like, Oh, man, I told him I had some back issues. And he said, Oh, you should come to my office because he lived really close to where I lived, or his office was. And so anyway, I went in there and I'm not kidding you, he adjusted me. I loved it. I was like, Wow, the second time I came back, he handed me a book. Why when I got in his office, I mean, I barely knew the guy's names, Brian Haas, shout out to Brian Haas, long time ago. And he said something, my intuition told me that I'm going to give you this book today. And I was like, Okay, I mean, I was like sitting in his waiting room, right? I'd only had one adjustment with him in my life. And I was waiting for my second, he handed to me it was called the sanctity of human blood. And it was this book, which many people still don't know, because it's been suppressed. But it was like all the world's leading pathologists came together to write this book talking about how vaccines were fraught, it was all the technology was flawed, that it really wasn't doing anything for immunity. And here's all of our scientific proof and evidence. And so I was just like looking at this book, you know, looking at him, he left, you know, he went to work on his patients. And I was like, Oh, this is weird. Like, why did you give this to me? And then I started reading it. And then I just was like, Wow, now I know what this is part of my mission. And so like, I, I give you that story, because it's like a sidetrack. But like, I know for a fact that when I came out, I was like avenging my, you know, my older brother who barely lived for a couple days death, you know, post vaccine. And again, I don't want to like rabbit hole this entire podcast, because we're talking about all these amazing things. But there are people out there that have compiled data on every person who's ever died of quote unquote, SIDS, which is sudden infant death syndrome, and they can actually correlate it to actually vaccine related injury.

Melanie Avalon
Oh, wow. That's wild. Yeah, it was actually a doctor.

Jay Campbell
Florida. I never mentioned his name. I'm happy to give it to you if you ever wanted to interview him. I don't know if he would interview you.

Melanie Avalon
No. Okay. Nevermind. Okay. I'm really speaking in code already.

Jay Campbell
or other people. So maybe you did interview somebody, but there are people out there that have caught, who've kept records of this. And it's pretty insane when you really start cross-referencing and look at the data points of all these people who've died of SIDS and then realize that 99.9% of them were given multiple vaccines within about a 10-hour period of dying.

It's insane.

Melanie Avalon
You were aware of this even as a kid? Well, I wasn't.

Jay Campbell
But once I started reading that book, I started like all this, like I started just, I mean, I don't wanna go to Lulu, but I started receiving downloads. And it was like, this is my mission. Like I have to preach to people and teach people to avoid getting the, you know what, tell parents, whatever. But at that point, no, I mean, I had no clue. I mean, every one of my family was VAX. My mom and dad didn't know any better, blah, blah, blah. So it was just a very strange thing. But then subsequently since then, I've helped thousands of people in my life avoid it.

And I still get messages from parents all the time now, especially where we are now, saying I have no idea how much you've helped my family and my kids, you know, because they've never been sick a day in their life and blah, blah, blah. And again, I don't wanna rabbit hole. This is I think a good intro because it's not perfectly about peptides, but it does get to a point in some point in this conversation about peptides, because listen, you said it on your intro, why have peptides become so mainstream and so first level consciousness? And honestly, Melanie, it's because people are looking for alternative healing from the vaccine, from the COVID vaccine. And that's why, you know, my name and my book and all of this stuff has catapulted since 2023, because very truthfully, my book came out on January 31st, technically February 1st, according to Amazon, but January 31st on Amazon in 2023. And that was the height of the post-vaccination blues of all these people suffering, all these people dealing with, you know, autoimmune issues, you know, spike protein issues. There's so much and so many people are still not willing or just call it reluctant to say, you know, I made a mistake or, you know, I shouldn't have done it. And as you know, I mean, again, that's a horrible time in our history. I mean, how many people were forced to do it? You know, they losing their job or, you know, if they were in the medical system, they had no option. I mean, you know, we have kids that were division one athletes that had to get the shots. So, I mean, like there were so many people that were forced into this. And so it just happened that my book came out right into like the peak of this time when all these people were looking for alternative forms of healing. And I say that on every podcast I go to, they're like, why do you think peptides are so mainstream consciousness? Because as you know, they're difficult to administer. You know, it requires a pretty decently above average IQ to reconstitute and to understand milligram versus microgram and all these things. So it really came about due to the facts and to people looking for alternative forms of healing. That's why, I mean, obviously it's blown up much more so now in the last two years as people have found out about what they do. But that was the real reason in 2023 that my book exploded. I mean, I'd like to think that it was a really good book, but it was also just in the right place at the right time.

Melanie Avalon
Wow, so speaking of that timeline, you're saying it was the right place at the right time. Were you writing it primarily for that reason? Or were you writing it more generally?

Jay Campbell
Absolutely not. To go back to the original Jay Campbell story, I was a college athlete, played basketball. I did not have any aspirations to become a bodybuilder or a fitness person. I was always just very astute as an examiner of the human physique. I appreciated male and female physiques. I also had this unique skill to look at people and I could tell how fast they would be or how high they could jump. It was just really weird. I understood muscle fiber typing and stuff as a little kid. Again, how do you know these things? I don't know. It was just an aspect of my personality and my observational skills as I learned that kind of stuff.

Then when I graduated from college, moved out to California, wanted to be an actor, begin an entertainment industry, blah, blah, blah, I did a little bit of work and stuff like that. Once I started playing basketball, or not playing college basketball, but playing basketball again competitively, I was kicked into testicles. This was when I was 29 years old. When I got kicked into testicles, it was a real problem for me. It was about eight or nine weeks later I started getting run down. My body was broken down. I went to, and again, as you know, in my world, there's no coincidence. There's only synchronicities. I went to my PPO doctor. I was working for the Los Angeles Times at this point. It was literally like 1999. He referred me to an endocrinologist. The endocrinologist happened to be a world-renowned endocrinologist in Pasadena, California by the name of Dr. Raymond Scruggs. When he saw me, he took my labs and he said, you have the testosterone levels of a geriatric, somebody in their age. He says, I can restore you by giving you therapeutic testosterone. Now again, this is 1999. I'm literally one or two months, I'm pretty sure it was in December, from turning 30, which my birthday is on February 24th. He explained everything to me, the pros and the cons. He said, you should probably go home and talk to your wife at the time, she was my fiance, to make sure that you guys are both good with this. I didn't have any kids or anything like that. I did, and I talked to her. Again, shout out to her. My first wife, she's long gone. Kelly is her name. By the way, she's in Atlanta. She lives in Meadow Creek, I think, or somewhere up there, somewhere in North Atlanta. Bottom line is, she said, yeah, we're smart people. Let's do it. He put me on therapeutic testosterone, and I was on the treatment for seven or eight weeks. When I went to see him, I started feeling much better. I had a lot of issues with my low back and stuff like that. I just had all sorts of problems because I was run down from obviously getting kicked in the testicles. I had some sort of what they would call class two hypogonadism. The therapeutic testosterone made me feel amazing.

Jay Campbell
When he went to take me off, I was like, dude, you're not taking me off this. This is the greatest i've ever felt my life like i want to learn more about this i want to become like you know this.

Marauder this maverick and like learn how to use this and teach other people how to use so this whole story you know co coincides with the idea that the same time i was learning about therapeutic hormones cuz back then. First off taking therapy testosterone was like considered steroids there were there were very few people that understood the administration of therapy testosterone only people like in the life extension foundation uh which was called lef back then you know you understood this kind of stuff and so it was completely out of the mainstream uh and so when i started doing it and then learning about it and reading about it and as you know that was the infancy of the online world as well there wasn't a lot of research there was you know nelson virgil's book testosterone a man's guide and he wrote a book because he had hiv and he was dying or at least they thought you know anybody who had that diagnosis then was dying and so he was searching for ways to enhance his immune system and then there was another book called built to survive which was also nelson and another doctor by the name dr michael moonie but that was it there was nothing else in the clinical literature that you could read about using therapeutic testosterone unless you could read russian or bulgarian strength manuals and obviously we didn't have ai to translate stuff back then so there was nothing so it was just literally me on underground bodybuilding forums and performance enhancement forums talking to other people about you know the therapeutic usage of testosterone along with other things like you know anabolic steroids any kind of performance enhancing products and then at the same time and when i say same time it was like literally two and a half to three years later into my journey peptides were brought to me and the first peptide that i started using and this is crazy i started using peptides in 2004 right so 21 years ago and then the first pep that i started using was called epimarelin and obviously many many people that will listen to this podcast know what epimarelin was but so at the same time i was learning my way and you know literally biohacking myself shout out to the lollies you know literally i was learning about peptides at the same time and so i had this long term of like you know biohacking myself you know self experimenting whatever you want to call it call myself a human guinea pig trying all these different things and eventually you know i wrote my books on testosterone which were very successful in 2015 and then 2018 most of the people in my inner circle convinced me to write a book on peptides but melanie i was very much against it because it's such a gray area You know like just talking about peptides was always like a very underground thing like I didn't really talk about it in public if somebody.

Jay Campbell
What deep with me and said hey man can you talk to me about you know what else do you do i would say oh well you know i use these things but it was never something i really talked about in the public and so you know once the medical community started using peptides you know technically off label in about two thousand seventeen two thousand eighteen some of my same friends that convinced me to write my book on testosterone convinced me to write a book on peptides. But it took a long time to get it out because obviously COVID happened.

Melanie Avalon
when you were on the testosterone or being on testosterone does that suppress sperm production like does it create

Jay Campbell
fertility? It does. I mean, it can. It doesn't always.

I mean, but when you use therapeutic testosterone and you do it correctly, you can take analogs, which are FSH and LH, which is follicle-stimulating hormone and luteinizing hormone, memetics or drugs or meds or whatever, to keep your sperm modal, to keep fertility active. And I'm living proof of that because I had both of my daughters while I was using therapeutic testosterone. In fact, 10 years later. So there's a, there's, I would call it a lot of misinformation about using therapeutic hormones and whether or not they're going to cause, make a man or a woman infertile. They can, but the truth is, is that they don't always do it. And if you know what drugs to use in combination or what medical field would say concomitantly, you won't have that issue at all. You just have to know what you're doing. And again, and, you know, not to besmirch the allopathic medical world, which I call sick care medicine, they, they're not taught this. This is not something that is taught in medical school. And of course, why would big pharma want people to understand how to manipulate hormones? It would literally destroy the, you know, the billion dollar big pharma medical system of distributing, you know, a Rockefeller petroleum distillate medications. I mean, that's a gigantic multi trillion dollar industry. So if they taught doctors how to use hormones to optimize people's health, as they got older, it would kill their business model.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, I love the whole vibe of being on like the message boards and the forums and figuring it all out. Not at all on the level that you did, but that's how I first got into just figuring out like the science of diet. I did a lot of like self experimentation with things and like I remember ordering methylene blue like a decade ago and you had to order like fish tank cleaner off of Amazon and like dilute it. And I was like, am I going to kill myself? So it's so interesting though about the gray area aspect of it, especially because I mean this is how much, how little I know and how much the confusion I think is out there.

So reading your book, I didn't realize for example like insulin is a peptide and people might be aware, obviously like GLP1 agonist and such are peptides, but it's really interesting how it's a vague gray area, seems a little bit sketchy, seems a little even like woo-woo or you know, just off, off color and yet at the same time there's you know, pharmaceutical versions that are being used and so I think people are just very confused. The Hepamorellin, what did you, and I'm so happy that you mentioned that story because I was going to ask you like what was your first moment with the peptide? What was that for? Was it for body physique or what was its purpose?

Jay Campbell
By the way, I have a funny story around this. My first testosterone injection, this is a true story. Anybody who knows me is like, oh, Jay Campbell's the king of testosterone. He's Mr. Alpha. Why would he be afraid? My very first testosterone injection, and this just proves that everyone has what is called tyrannophobia, which is the fear of needles initially. Anyone can overcome that. It's like brushing your teeth. I tell people once you've learned how to do it. But I sat there for two hours with the syringe in my hand, and I could not, Melanie, inject myself and my ex-wife again, shout out to Kelly. She came up to me and she saw me sitting there and she's like, oh my God. I mean, she knew, because she could see me sweating and she could see that I was a little red in the face or whatever. She just grabbed it and just jabbed me in the quad and boom, pushed it in. She's like, you're such a weasel. And I'm sitting there going, oh, it's not a big deal, right? So I mean, I tell people that story because it's still a huge hang up for most people.

I mean, again, it's called literally tyrannophobia and it's called the fear of needles, a fear of injections. And so you've got a massive amount of people out there that are afraid of this. But to your question, so in my discoveries and in my self experimentation and my biohacking of myself and being a human guinea pig, I started reading about growth hormone and growth hormone agonists and IGF-1 production and all these things that you find out as you are going down these rabbit holes. And a good friend of mine who was, you know, like you said, an undergrounder, by the way, we probably share a lot of similarities in our stories. But this person messaged me and he was like, hey, dude, like you need to check this out. And it was about this peptide, hip and bone. And he actually sent me a PDF. I remember it like it was clean as day or clean as day about why it was the number one peptide to use. Now, at this time, again, this is in 2004, I've been on therapeutic testosterone for about four and a half years now. So I'm pretty knowledgeable about it. And I've never used peptides and peptides were brand new. And there were also at that time like G.H.P.R. to G.H.P.R. six. There were a bunch of like random, you know, just starting to make their name in the underground communities as growth hormone agonists. Now, anyone at that time, this is again, 2004, 2003, who was a bodybuilder or was in that realm, they understood that growth hormone and testosterone together were very synergistic and it would enhance the anabolic effects of testosterone and also enhance the lipolytic, which are the fat burning effects of growth hormone. So when you took them together, you could build bigger, leaner people. And that obviously applies to both men or women. It doesn't matter. And so when these growth hormone agonist peptides were pronounced or given to me or, you know, announced to me and I started reading about them, you know, if a morale was the one that stuck out because and this is why it's, you know, one of the most effective peptides today for anyone in isolation,

Jay Campbell
especially women is. It had this unique ability to not disturb the body's endogenous production of growth hormone, right? So our pancreas, essentially our pancreas, and there's some other master glands that are involved, but, you know, secrete insulin, and at the same time, like, we also have this ability to actually secrete growth hormone, and obviously, as we get older, growth hormone production gets weaker or cessation. And so if you can take a peptide that will increase the body's endogenous production of growth hormone through increasing IGF-1 levels, which is interstitial growth fluid, you can also enhance the body's natural production of growth hormone. So that's what epimyrelin did, but it had this unique ability to not also increase cortisol or prolactin, which are other hormonal systems that you don't want going up, which the other peptides, GHRP2 and GHPR6, did disturb. So this is why I was like, okay, I'm going to look at this because there's going to be no side effects. And that was, again, the claim to fame for epimyrelin.

Even to this day, if you use it in a microdose fashion, it's usually side effect-free or, you know, the most you would ever feel would be like some sort of a, maybe a mild blushing or a flushing effect if you, it took it your first or second time. But again, it's nothing that you can't handle and it doesn't make you, you know, feel nauseous or anything like that. But it's one of those peptides where it's just on paper, you know, theoretically, it's awesome. And then also when you start using it. So long story short, I started using it in combination with my testosterone, and I instantly saw deeper sleep without a doubt, better skin quality. I mean, I'm still relatively young. I'm like 34, 35 at this point. And also more like better wellbeing and more energy. So again, that's the normal that somebody sees or feels when they're hormonally optimized and then they start using growth hormone agonist peptides, which we'll get into.

But that was like literally the first one that came into, it's called the underground consciousness was epimyrelin. And that was in 2004. And you, you know, you asked me like, where did I get it? True story. It was a compound pharmacy in Texas is long gone. And they were selling it out the back door of the research chemical. But very truthfully, and this is we can get into this on this podcast. I think it's fascinating. It's worth talking about. It was literally made in a pharmacy under all the same rules and regulations that any, you know, FDA approved pharmacy, it just was sold out the back door as a research chemical. And that's kind of what's honestly today happening, Melanie, with like compounded formation or compounded formulations of peptides versus research chemical peptides. The difference is very minimal other than that the compounded versions are in the FDA's purview and are, you know, in that whole game of like getting approved versus the research chemical companies don't have FDA approval. That's like the main difference.

Melanie Avalon
Oh my goodness, do you know Jean Valacara? Of course, yes. When I asked for questions for you, he literally said, quote, research peptides versus compound pharmacy. So you,

Jay Campbell
You just answered that so I mean I just gave me the answer I mean most people don't know this and I'm happy to talk about this Before bio longevity labs, which is obviously my company launched technically December when we announced actually at Las Vegas We had a giant global PR campaign that kicked off there about our company you know, we hired regulatory attorney and Talked to some other people that were connected to him about like, you know, what was our what was the legal purview of being involved? In the research space and what could you know, what could you get away with, you know, what's gray about it? Is there really any you illegalities about it and very strangely it avoids the purview of the FDA? It's not research is not considered medical But when you sell in this space like we do and many other people do like peptide sciences I'm sure you're familiar with that company You have to do certain things that disclaim that you're not a human use or you're not Providing I shouldn't say that you're not providing Medical credibility to people so what that means is like if they order from a research chemical company You're not allowed to provide them instructions how to use the peptides I know that sounds absolutely retarded But that's kind of the rules of engagement as research versus compounded now Obviously the other differences are if you buy a research product, it's not made already, right?

If you buy a compounded product, it's already reconstituted again I'm we're talking about injectable peptides right now, but it's already reconstituted with bacterial static water or injection solution Whatever you want to call it and it's already ready for you to take it out of the while and inject it So that's like the biggest difference and again, it's like a game That's being played between the FDA and compound pharmacies and then the research chemical industry The FDA has technically no purview over the research chemical industry It just kind of like it stands by itself. And so that's why people have always thought of it as like this gray area I mean, obviously there's for sure and you know this there's definitely shady Companies that are selling research peptides now Especially in the last two years as this market has exploded and so many people talk about peptides its mass consciousness So you have to just be very cautious that the company that you pick if you do purchase from a research provider You know is doing everything right right like they have an FDA certified FDA registered lab You know their production facilities are legit They have certificates of authenticity on all their products because a lot of companies don't and so, you know You go on Facebook or you know Amazon or any of these places now on social media and you get targeted, you know by these peptide companies You got to be really cautious because some of these companies are legitimately fly by night and they may be brewing up some of these Batches in their basements or their kitchens. I'm not joking when I tell you that

Melanie Avalon
Is that the same area of ordering so back when i back in my internet forum research ordering stuff off the internet days i would order. They would call it like cosmetic use is that this is that similar is that a different here.

Jay Campbell
Kind of the similar like in in truths like it's dude. It's so bizarre It's technically, you know Some of these sites who don't have the right lawyers and don't know what to really say from a legal perspective We'll say not for human use and then they of course sell it says for research purposes only I mean, of course the way it's interpreted legally is Research can be on anything right?

It can be on a laboratory animal. It can be on a person I mean you are basically claiming that you're using whatever it is that you're using for research purposes only

Melanie Avalon
That makes sense. Yeah. I remember I would order like T3 and it was like from this.

Jay Campbell
Dude, you're a bro. You're definitely one of the brokers. Don't lie. You're one of the bros.

Melanie Avalon
I was I would I got so excited because you briefly mentioned in your peptide book stuff about fat burning You're talking about like alpha beta receptors and I got so many flashbacks to like forums and like looking up like a Fedron

Jay Campbell
I love talking about the A-Tunes and the B-Tunes and all that stuff. We can go so deep on fat loss if you want to, but yeah, it's funny.

You're literally just like me. I know we have a very similar background.

Melanie Avalon
So, I remember one time I ordered this one compound fat burning thing and then I got recalled from Amazon and I was like, oh my goodness. I was like, this is gold. I'm not sending this back. No.

Jay Campbell
Yes, we can put it on Alibaba and say I got the real deal, bro

Melanie Avalon
I know. It's like it's got this stuff in it. Yeah, no, I just love this conversation so much.

But it's so true that, I mean, it's so confusing for people. And like we were just saying, it could be really sketchy. Like you got to know, you got to trust, you know, what you're ordering.

Jay Campbell
And you can, it's pretty easy, right? Like all of these sites, if they're legit, they are publicly making their certificates of authenticity. The labs, the independent third parties that they use, you know, available, like you can't go to my site, bio longevity labs, and not find that, you know, on the category page or on the individual page for the products and stuff like that, like legitimate research companies like peptide sciences, like bio longevity labs, like core peptides, like there's a bunch of them. You know, we don't play games like that.

Like we let you know, like, hey, if you want to investigate us and you want to find out like what the, you know, batch number and the lot number is of the product that you're buying, here it is, you know, go and find it, do your public scrutiny and your deep dive research. And it's all there. But there are definitely companies, you know, that unfortunately now are out there that are not doing that. And so it is definitely buyer beware. Okay. Yeah.

Melanie Avalon
Oh, just really quickly, it's funny, my needle story is kind of the opposite of your story.

So I was very accustomed to injecting subcutaneously and I was very comfortable with it.

I was experimenting with HCG and like vitamins and stuff.

And then I ordered glutathione, and I hadn't done an IM injection before myself.

And I was like, oh, this is like so easy.

I'm like so good at injecting myself.

It's no big deal.

And I like started to do it and it hurts so bad.

I didn't get any of the glutathione in and then I never tried to get which is not good.

So I need to I need to fix that history of

Jay Campbell
Well, glutathione is, just to say it, yeah, I mean, it stings. And honestly, glutathione is much better taken as an IV, and you can dilute it with different forms of vitamins. But, I mean, there are people that do inject it, I mean, and trust me, back in the old school days, like that, you know, that in 2007, 2008, when glutathione first came out, we were all injecting it, and it was burning, and we realized, you know, you'd be proud of that burn mark on your skin.

Melanie Avalon
arm yeah no it's just it's just so funny I had so much confidence and then it just like all went out the window and I had spent a lot of money on that glutathione and that I never I never got the I never worked up the bravery to

Jay Campbell
try again. Well, I mean, it burns. I mean, you know, just we can sidestep and just say, you know, something similar is copper peptide, G H K C U. I mean, that's probably the number one peptide that women know about due to its, you know, I call it the ShamWow peptide because it does so many amazing things.

It's angiogenic. It eliminates fine lines and wrinkles and improves skin elasticity. It regrows hair. I mean, it does so many things, but if you inject it and you're one of those people, and again, this is my pet theory, the closer your ethnicity to the equatorial plane. So the more darker skin, the more melanin you produce, the more it burns because like ginger people don't feel anything. And so to me, and again, if you really go deep into the rabbit holes of things like this, you know, you look at the melanin, cortoid receptor complex peptides, like melanin tan one, melanin tan two oxytocin, you can start seeing that melanin is a very, very powerful self-regulating caught bioenergetic system in the body. And it does a lot of things. And I think that people who don't have a lot of melanin production, which again, are ginger people like red haired, you know, white, super white people, they can inject G H K C U and they don't even feel it because my ex business partner is one of those people. He's like a giant, you know, he's one of the red haired giant tribe and he doesn't feel it. You know, and I remember when he gave it to my wife, when my wife had some cosmetic surgery and he created this like super brew, shout out to Nick Andrews, he sent it to us and she injected it and she was like, I mean, my wife has insane pain tolerance and she was like, Oh my God. I was like, what's the matter? And she's like, uh, it's burning. And I'm like, how bad is it burning? And she's like, it's burning. And, and for my wife to complain about anything, I mean, this woman's pain tolerance is insane. But I mean, it was like, it was interesting cause I, at that point I did not know. And then obviously, you know, this was what we, this is my first company that we sold back in 2022. But when we found out about this, like it was in 2018 or 2019 and people then started emailing me or messaging me and saying, dude, what's up with G H K C U it burns. You know, Chris Gethin was injecting it into a scalp, you know, after he was working on like regrow his hair. And by the way, it does regrow hair. It's amazing. But he was injecting a scalp and he was like, Mike, this shit burns. You know, so I was just like, yeah, man, like, uh, I know we all love Chris, but like, it just, it's funny because it's just, again, some people, they don't get it.

Melanie Avalon
but most people do. Yeah, and I was surprised because you talk about that one in the book, and you do make a statement somewhere about, I don't know if you say it's like the best, but basically like if there was one peptide, like this is the one to think about.

And we probably, so stepping back a little bit, the question of what are peptides? What are peptides?

Jay Campbell
I've sent you all over the board and this is such a podcast. So peptides, I mean, I have a lot of answers, but your show is advanced. So peptides are fractionated proteins. And what that means is they're basically chains of signaling molecules. And the shorter the chain, the more apt it is to be consumed orally, to be used transdermally, to be snorted, you know, intranasally. I love saying the word snorted. True story, I've never done cocaine in my life. My brother, my brother Joey, who may have pertaken too much in his early use, used to say to me, he's like, Jay, you never do this because people do this to be like you naturally. So I was like, okay, that's enough. I'm never going to do cocaine.

But every now and then, you know, I think about it because I'll watch movies or whatever and I'll see like the craziness or I'll hear stories from friends about like how they had this insane sexual experience on Coke. And, you know, I thought about like, well, you know, maybe one night in Vegas with my wife, I'll do it. But I've never done it very truthfully. And by the way, I've done everything. I'm happy to talk about that. I'm a big plant medicine user. I've done lots of heroic doses of mushrooms and all sorts of other stuff, MDMA, all that stuff. But I've never done cocaine. But to the question about peptides, the longer the chain, the more effective it will be from, you know, an intramuscular or subcutaneous injection. And again, for your listening audience and for anyone, because we're going to be getting into new and novel delivery systems, injection is always going to be the highest impact delivery system. And why that is, Melanie, is because it crosses the blood-brain barrier the fastest and it gets into portal circulation the fastest. And for anyone listening to this podcast, it's very, very important that when you take peptides, whether you inject them, snort them, put them on your skin, and then we'll talk about the new formulation of, you know, buccal or buccal, which is you place those a wafer on your tongue, you've got to be fasted.

If your body is digesting food and producing insulin, when you inject or, you know, however you dose the peptide, your peptide is competing with insulin, right? And also crossing the blood-brain barrier. And so many people don't understand this. And, you know, I've been talking about this, you know, we can rabbit hole a little bit and talk about supplement consumption. But way back when, before peptides, anybody knew, well, I mean, I did, but very few people knew what peptides even were. It's always been the same thing. Like if you're taking a supplement that's an oral capsule, and it's a, call it a senolytic, or it's a thermogenic or something, if you take a supplement with food, it ain't going to work. It's blown me away that I've seen all these manufacturers of supplement companies, even in the bro world, and they never tell people to eat it fasted or to swallow it fasted. It's like, what are you doing?

Jay Campbell
You're competing with insulin. You're competing with salivary enzymes. You're competing with so many different things when you swallow a supplement or inject a peptide or take a buccal peptide if you're not fasted.

And so it's like I always tell people, and what does that mean, by the way? They'll be like, well, Jay, what does that mean? Dude, do you mean you got to go 10 hours without it? No, it means that you should not have any food in your stomach for 90 minutes. It's that simple, like 90 minutes. You've had nothing go into the mucosal membranes of the mouth. You've swallowed nothing that had sugar or fat or protein. That's how you have to take these things. Now, there'll be people that will come on here and argue with me and they'll say, that's not true. Jay Campbell's full of shit. You can take mitochondrial stuff because the mitochondria, blah, blah, blah, don't affect portal absorption or small digestion or liver hepatic passing or any of that stuff. And they're all right. But if you really want to maximize the use of anything you take, you should allow it to cross the blood-brain barrier free of competition. Does that make sense?

Melanie Avalon
Yeah. So I mean, cause that's a really, that's a big statement. Um, and I'm God we're talking about this cause nobody's, nobody's ever talked about this on the show before.

Does that apply even to something like, so I have a supplement line and I went down the rabbit hole trying to figure out what instructions to put on my magnesium bottles. And I found, you know, studies showing that it was like slightly better absorption with food actually for magnesium, but like magnesium three and eight crosses the blood brain barrier. So that might be an exception. But so like, are you saying like everything?

Jay Campbell
It's not saying everything, like certain vitamins and minerals like that, it's not as important to be fasted, but if you want maximum absorption and efficacy without competing with anything else in the bloodstream or competing with anything else in the digestive tract, yeah, you want to take it on an empty stomach. For magnesium, for example, by the way, magnesium-3-inate is one of my favorite supplements. We have a product coming out called BioFlow that actually has tesophansine, magnesium-3-inate, and taurine, and I promise you, it will be the probably number one selling product in the marketplace for nootropics because magnesium-3-inate is definitely a clinically understood and proven product enhancing both short-term and long-term memory in people that have depression, people that have neurodegenerative disease and disorders. I mean, it's an amazing product.

It's totally underutilized. We actually had it in one of my old products in a company that I sold a long time ago. It was called Energy Memory Focus, and it was like one of the most pronounced forms of all—I can't even remember all the things that we had in the way. I think we had teacrine and that and a bunch of other things, but that is an amazing supplement. But to answer your question, a lot of multivitamins and minerals are fat-soluble, water-soluble, so you can definitely take them with food, and you're not going to have any real issues from an absorption standpoint, but anything that you—the best way to say it is for fat burning, is for growth hormone enhancement, hormonal optimization or tweaking, or thyroid production or thyroid stimulation. Probably not insulin stuff like you can take metformin and dihydroburberin with carbohydrates. I mean, you should take it a little bit before you eat your carbohydrates to blunt the blood glucose response, but most things are going to be better absorbed and better utilized and better felt on an empty stomach. And like I said, I like saying an empty stomach is somewhere between 60 and 90 minutes without food. You surely cannot swallow coke or fruit juice or something that's acidic with carbohydrates in it, and it is in the mouth at the same time you're taking these, because that's going to absolutely compete, crossing the blood-brain barrier with whatever it is you're taking. So the best rule of thumb to really summarize this is if you can, take a lot of your stuff first thing in the morning when you wake up.

Melanie Avalon
What about taking it all to like multiple things together though if I showed you

Jay Campbell
If this was a video, I had my supplement container I was gonna show you. I mean, I literally swallow probably 30 to 35 capsules or 30 to 35 products at a time.

Melanie Avalon
in the morning okay so there's not as much of a concern of them competing with each other i mean there is that but

Jay Campbell
Like, you know, I mean, that's a great question. And yes, the answer is 100%.

There is cross-chain linking and reactions and stuff like that. But if you're taking, you know, the majority of your things, let's just say you're taking something to optimize your hormones. You're taking stuff to optimize insulin production. You're taking stuff to enhance fat burning or thermogenesis or stuff like that. Like most of those things can be taken together. You know, if you're taking like spermidine, if you're taking like stuff to enhance joint strength or integrity and stuff like that, like most of those things can be taken together on an empty stomach. I'm sure that there's some biochemists or molecular engineers out there that'll say, Jay Campbell's full of shit. He has no idea what he's doing. And they may actually be able to point to me that I could be wrong on some of the things, but I've been doing this for literally 20 years and I have a pretty young biological age and I think you know what I look like. And so, I mean, it's definitely not interfering.

Melanie Avalon
hearing with me. Okay.

And I do a really similar approach. And oh, speaking of biological age. So I had on, I know you're a fan of true diagnostics. You've talked about that in the book. Yeah. Ryan's a good friend. I've had them on, I had on, do they, okay, are they their own? I've had on so many different companies, but I had on one company that they worked with the pace aging one, um, that was developed at, I don't even know, one of the universities like Harvard or something. And I was literally with, what company was it? I should know this. Is it like an age?

Jay Campbell
No, I don't think so. There's so many of them now. And by the way, none of them are ready for prime time. And Ryan will even say that.

I mean, they're there and Ryan's a genius and one of my good friends. I would say they're three to five years out from really, I don't want to call it perfecting it, but getting it to a point where there's not a lot of error margin because I'm sure you've heard stories of people that have done the test. And it was like they're in amazing shape and have amazing insulin sensitivity and super low A1C. And they score like they're three times their age. And then they complain and they're like, this is not possible. And then either true diagnostic or I'm just using glycan age right now. It could be another company. But they'll come back and say, oh, there was an error. The testing is flawed. We'll do it again. And these people are like, I'm not doing it again. I need you to give me my money back. You know what I mean? So it's not ready for prime time in the way they're testing people. I know I wouldn't say it's flawed. But there's definitely, I would say there's definitely issues with the technology right now.

Melanie Avalon
on Dr. Matt Dawson. Do you know him? He's the CEO of True Diagnostics.

Jay Campbell
I don't know him personally, but I know.

Melanie Avalon
who he is, yes. Okay, so I had him on for True Diagnostic.

It is True Diagnostic. So they do the Omakum age with Harvard, the Doonden pace with Duke and Columbia and then Symphony with Yale. And he told me from my pace, this was the CEO of True Diagnostic. He said mine was one of the lowest ones he's ever seen, which was so, I mean, on the one hand, it's like really exciting because I was like, okay, all this stuff I'm doing is working. But on the other hand, I agree with everything you said that, I don't know, like it's not, it's hard to say any one of them is, you know, verifiable is like the objective telling you data that, you know, isn't, it's hard to know what actually, what we can take from it basically.

Jay Campbell
I mean, it is you're right, by the way, it really is hard to know because, like I said, I mean, I have some friends in my inner circle, you know, who paid me a good amount of money who, you know, I recommend to them and they had all these tests done and, you know, everything turned out great. And then they went to that and they were like, bro, what's going on? You know, when I went back to them, I said, this is not possible. They were like, oh, well, there could be an issue with our machine, you know, send it back to us and we'll send you another kid or whatever. And like, it was three separate people is two men and one woman. And they were all just like, I'm not, I'm not paying for this again.

You know what I mean? So it's like I just, I just know there's issues with it, you know, you know, whether they've perfected the technology, they perfected the algorithm, they perfected the math, the permutations, you know, whatever. I don't know. I don't, I really don't want to say anything bad because again, I love Ryan and I love, you know, everything he does. And I stand behind him and support him. I just think that those technologies are still.

Melanie Avalon
not ready for prime time. I'm excited though to see where it goes.

I will say out of all, because I've done so many different ones, the one marker that's been, if it tests it that has been the same for me, because sometimes it'll test something and one test will say one thing and another one will say something kind of conflicting. And I'm like, oh well, don't know what to do with that then. My telomeres though have always come back pretty good, like on all the different tests. So I'm like, I feel like they're doing okay.

But then even telomeres are complicated because they change pretty transiently I think. So look, here's the...

Jay Campbell
the truth about telomeres, you're probably familiar, there's two peptides, epikachin, there's actually three, epikachin, epitauon, and then thymelin. And all of these, they're really actually bioregulators.

Melanie Avalon
Like from green tea, Epic? No, that's EpiCad again? No, not-

Jay Campbell
I mispronounced it, it's Epitalon, but it's also, well, I call it mispronunciated, but there's like two forms of it because the Russians spell it differently than we spell it. So it's like Epitalon and Epithalon or something like that, it's bizarre, but it's basically the same bioregulator.

One of them is injectable, though, and one of them is oral. And again, to talk about bioregulators, because I don't want to rabbit hole on you right here, they are separate, they are a separate category of peptides, and they are Oregon and biological system specific. And they're amazing. And again, my company sells them, and we can go deep down the rabbit hole. Those are all Dr. Vladimir Kavinson, shout out to him, may he rest in power. He died in December of 2023, but he's kind of the father of bioregulators. But those products have been shown in clinical studies in Russia for 40, 50 years, extend the life of your telomeres to improve telomerase production. It does a lot of amazing stuff. But what I was going to tell you about why you have probably really strong telomeres is because one, your DNA, and I'm not saying it's an excuse, you don't work hard, but telomerase is definitely a DNA component. And then you're lean. And look, I tell people this all the time. If you want to live longest and strongest, it is statistically proven you have to be lean.

Leaner people live longer. That is a fact. Now I'm not saying you have to be 5% or 6%, you know, competition male bodybuilder lean. But what people have to understand is that all of the diseases of aging, every single one of them, all come from cellular inflammation. Cellular inflammation leads to physical degradation, and the degradation is what ultimately yields the disease state. And so it's like if you don't have a lot of body fat, right? And when I say a lot of body fat, because people will ask me like, what does this mean, Jay? Like, what is a preferred level for a man and what is a preferred level for a woman? And I know this, and again, I know this from a course at the scientific studies, preferred for a man is somewhere under 15%. Now, if you want to be elite and absolutely insure yourself outside of a tragic accident or a calamity happening to you, then you should be around 10% to 12% as a man. Now as a woman, you're going to statistically live longer if your body fat is somewhere between 17% and 23%. Now remember, women, and again, so many people don't understand this, women have a higher level of internal body fat than men, and it's purely for evolutionary, biologic, child-bearing reasons. You guys carry internal fat for the babies. And even if you don't have kids, when you get older, it's still measured internally. So a shredded, absolutely bikini, you know, physique woman with a full six-pack on stage is literally like 11% body fat. Now they don't understand that because they're like, oh, I'm 4%, I measure on the calipers, but they don't understand they have internal fat, that they're not measuring, okay? So that's always the difference.

Jay Campbell
It's like somewhere between 5% and 6% women have more internal body fat. And again, it's purely for child-bearing purposes. So that's always going to be the case.

So like a woman who has 15% or 16% body fat is super lean and protected from a standpoint of like living longer. Now there are some people out there that will argue that the lower your body fat, the less you're protected vascularly, or the less you're protected from a bone mineral density standpoint. And there's some merit to that, but that's also why like as we get older, you have to really understand like what your natural hormone production is because you can obviously easily tweak and modulate that by undergoing hormone.

Melanie Avalon
hormonal optimization. It's funny, now I'm having more flashbacks to my rabbit hole Reddit forum days.

I remember I was researching body fat receptors and where they are. And I remember reading, I don't know if this is true or if you've heard this, but I read that for women, like thigh fat specifically is safe for pregnancy. So the time to, not that you should lose fat while you're pregnant or anything, but basically when you have a baby, you're more likely to burn off your thigh fat.

Jay Campbell
I don't know if that's true. That is true. That is true. I'll give you some other crazy stuff.

So if you have two children, statistically, your thyroid is damaged if not destroyed. Oh, wow. Yeah. So when a woman carries a baby for two terms, that being that biology is running on your thyroid. So why so many women's thyroid is damaged after two children is because of that. And again, the medical system is completely negligent and clueless. I mean, there's a book. You can Google it. You can probably buy it for 50 cents now on Amazon called Stop the Thyroid Madness. And it's been read by millions of women around the world. Yes, I read that. Yes. And it's an amazing book that teaches people the truth about thyroid. And almost all women who struggle with losing weight after having two kids is because their thyroid is damaged. And, Melanie, the sad part is, is that, again, the allopathic system doesn't understand how to treat it. And what do they do? They give them T3 or T4. And T3 and T4 does not address all of the thyroid hormones. You got to address T1, T2, T3, and T4. And that's why, obviously, desiccated or porcine thyroid, which is major thyroid, armor thyroid, NP thyroid.

Melanie Avalon
There's another one. It's hard to get those now though. I don't even know how many of those brands.

Jay Campbell
I just have to reach out to me, I can get it for you. No, I mean, it is. I mean, they do make it very difficult to get it because, again, they don't want healthy people in our society. But it's crazy how many women are destitute, and I'm going to go deeper on this because I want to talk about this, but they're destitute for testosterone and destitute for thyroid. And they go hand in hand. And there are so many women in this country who are in desperate, desperate need of therapeutic testosterone who are not getting it because their doctors are literally afraid of it causing cancer. I mean, I could go on. I mean, this is like a big bugaboo for me, and I go crazy. But I have seen so many women who are in their 50s and 60s who are not on testosterone who need to be, that it blows my mind. And most of their doctors have them on estrogiol and progesterone and not on testosterone.

And they're so ignorant of the pleiotropic nature of both estrogen and testosterone. Do you realize that if you give a post-menopausal woman a good amount of therapeutic testosterone that she will cleave all of that through the aromatase enzyme into estrogen, and she will have the estrogen levels like she had when she was in her 20s. But when you don't give them testosterone, you fuck them up. And you actually make them worse. And so all these docs out there, they're giving women progesterone and estradiol without giving them testosterone are further castrating them. And then don't even get me going on women that have had esteractomies. If they don't get testosterone, I mean, they're eunuchs. I mean, good luck having sex. They can't get lubricated. They cannot get any kind of flow. I mean, forget it. And this is why you see so many women, their relationships break down. The man is like, they're still married for financial reasons or the kids or whatever bullshit. And they don't even sleep in the same bedroom. It's horrible, but this is all medical malpractice. This is all due to the WHI event that unfortunately was based on equine, premarin, or whatever it was, whatever the drug was. And by the way, all the studies were flawed. But there were some people that got cancer from taking equine, again, whatever the hormones were. And whether it was flawed or they were comorbid people, and they were mostly comorbid people, it doesn't matter. It destroyed an entire generation of women getting hormones.

Melanie Avalon
And it was a tiny relative risk increase.

Jay Campbell
even then. It's so minor.

I'm telling you right now, do you realize that most people in America, including oncologists and doctors that work with male prostate, think that testosterone causes prostate disease or prostate cancer? You know it's the inverse of that, right? It's the inverse. The leading doctor in the world on prostates and testosterone is Dr. Abraham Morgenthaler. He's a good friend of mine. He's a Harvard-educated doctor, and he has done all the research, and he is now constantly – he doesn't battle it anymore because he's put out all these white papers and documents and stuff like that, but he now has clinically proven it's the opposite of what they think. Those who have a testosterone deficiency are more likely to get prostate cancer than those that actually have optimized testosterone.

It's insane. It's like the inverse of everything that everyone ever thought, and I interviewed him and I knew this, and I put this in my book 10 years ago, and people still to this day don't know it.

I mean, do you have any idea how many men come to me saying my doctor won't give me testosterone because I have stage one prostate cancer? And I'm like, oh my God, please read this. Please show him this. But they're against it.

Testosterone causes prostate cancer. Testosterone causes BPH. Testosterone causes this and that, and it's like – it's actually the opposite of

Melanie Avalon
evidence and the part about women having access at the biohiking conference I met with one of the I'm actually gonna have them on the show in a while from now but it was like an oral testosterone supplement and I walked up and I was like I'm so excited to like educate about women in testosterone he was like well technically we can't this isn't for women yet I was like

Jay Campbell
Can you believe that? Well, let me just tell you this because I'm very outspoken about this now, and I've had a bunch of stuff go viral on this. Women, there's only two delivery systems that work, and this is for men and women. And this is injectable. And by the way, just so you know, the delivery systems of testosterone that are injectable and transnormal have improved dramatically in the last five years. And what I mean by that is, is again, go back to 1999 when I first started injecting testosterone. It was in like cottonseed oil, you know, it was very viscous. You had to use a very like a 22 or 23 gauge needle to inject testosterone, which by the way, does create scar tissue. You do not have to do that now. You can use a 30 or 31 gauge insulin needle to inject testosterone. It's in MCT oil. It's in grapeseed oil. There's even another carrier oil now that's a palmitic acid that is like instantly absorbed. I forget what it's called, but it's a form of MCT oil. So a woman can inject with an insulin needle, intramuscularly, subcutaneously, anywhere. And it's like three seconds and it's done. There's no scar tissue. There's nothing, right? So it's like, you know, so many people have hangups over needles and I get it and I understand and I respect it. But there's no reason for that.

And then the creams, just so you know this, I don't know if anyone's ever told you this on this podcast, but at the base of the man's scrotum is the most permeable skin location. So if you put a 20 milligram, I'm sorry, a 200 milligram per milliliter, atravaceous or not aqueous, but a cream, a compounded testosterone cream right there, they will get a very similar if not equal effect to injections. So now in the same vein, if you give a woman a cream, a compounded cream, and it's obviously a much lower dose. It can be anywhere from like 10 milligrams per milliliter to 15 to 20 milligrams per little liter. And you put it on the clitoral head or the inside of the labia wall of the vagina. It's the same. It's the same, you know, sensitivity, the same permeability. So you're literally able to place the creams in those locations for men and women and get very similar effects to injections.

Now again, everyone's biochemically unique. You've heard that a million times. I'm sure a thousand people have told you that on your show. Everyone's N of one. So you have to kind of figure out between those two delivery systems what's best. Now there are oral delivery systems for women. My wife used one for a while. I know thousands of women that have used different ones. They also will compound like lozenges that also have estradiol and progesterone in them. And if you know, look, if you're using those and they work for you, you know, when I say they work, you actually feel stronger, sexier, enhanced libido, more energy, great. but if they don't and you don't feel that and this is what i get in gather from most of the women that i talked to my life.

Jay Campbell
Injectable or cream you know again down there is by far the best delivery systems and more and more women are starting to find this out like we as i said you know i've had some stuff go viral recently as more women learn to inject testosterone. Their lives become i mean it's insane i mean it's so much better now listen i want to say this because people hear this and they think steroids and they freak out a woman injecting testosterone here's the levels if you're perimenopause or postmenopause it's going to be somewhere from six to twelve i'm sorry perimenopause is somewhere from six to twelve milligrams per week and if you're postmenopausal it can be somewhere from twelve to literally five to twelve.

50 milligrams per week and if you're a woman who's been chemically castrated because you had a you know your uterus removed you can do more now women that are pre menopausal obviously still you know child productive or child rearing years you even even you can take a very low dose of testosterone and not disturb your fertility but you know again you have to experiment with that and it's definitely somewhere between like two and four maybe two and five milligrams a week. But i swear to god molly i don't know a single woman that i have consulted about this who has not seen a dramatic life transformation by taking testosterone dramatic absolutely dramatic in all wells improves hair strength tensile strength obviously better fat burning way better libido they get their sex drive back they get their ability to you know get moist and get ready like they were in their twenties i mean all of it comes back.

There's there's no difference between a man and a woman when you hormonally optimize them the difference is that a man requires a higher amount of testosterone than a woman does but that's it but we all function the same way by a lot.

Melanie Avalon
Wow. And would women need to do any sort of testing of levels before that or can they just go based on age and symptoms?

Jay Campbell
I mean, it's a good question. I would say age and symptoms, but you can't get a doctor, obviously, in this whacked-out allopathic world that we have today to not, I mean, to prescribe until you do a blood test. So clearly, you can go to any independent lab and you can get your free testosterone and you can get your sensitive estradiol and obviously you can get your progesterone and there's obviously SDHEA and predinolone and a bunch of other, you know, called steroid hormones that you can look at. But most women, I'm telling you, without a doubt, especially, and of course, this applies to men too in this contaminated world that we live in, are gonna do better with a microtherapeutic dose of testosterone without a doubt.

Any woman who's been chemically castrated, who's had their uterus removed, needs testosterone. All postmenopausal women need testosterone. I mean, remember, they're not making anything anymore. How is a woman gonna get estrogen if they don't have testosterone? Estrogen is what comes from testosterone cleaving molecularly. It's all just such a just misunderstanding of the world. If we talk about this in men, in men, it's like the same shit with blocking estrogen in men. 90% of doctors, literally, who administer therapeutic hormones or therapeutic testosterone in men think they have to block estrogen with an AI and aromatase inhibitor medication. It is literally shortening the lifespan of every single man who uses an aromatase inhibitor, shortening their lifespan. That is clinically proven and yet 90% of doctors still do it.

Melanie Avalon
That's how broken it is does so for men supplementing testosterone if they do have an over you know like I'm too much estrogen will that just naturally regulate by.

Jay Campbell
Yeah, you got it right. So what happens is if you give a man again who has a clinical need therapeutic testosterone and you don't block it, and this is so rare that it happens in today's day and age, it will literally fall to their unique genetic level. Oh, wow. Yes. So and by the way, just so you know, there's no such thing as high estrogen. Estrogen is what again, a pleiotropic hormone is what confers all the protection to biological system functioning, right? So it makes your bone mineral density stronger. It improves your skin tone and quality. It improves vascular health. It improves brain health. I mean, anyone who goes on therapeutic testosterone instantly realizes they're like, holy shit, my brain's working again.

My dopamine signaling is turned back on, right? So it does all these things. And so you want testosterone, you know, given clinically surgically precise dose to aromatase or aromatize is the correct word into estrogen, which is really estradiol because it's the estradiol that provides all the protection. The estradiol is what gives you all of the effect that the tissues. So again, bone mineral density, estrogen, brain health, estrogen, cardiovascular health, estrogen, skin health, estrogen, sexual function, estrogen. Do you realize that all these men who go on testosterone and say it doesn't work also were on an AI. And so these dumb quack doctors have suppressed their estradiol into the single digit levels. They can't even get an erection. Their brain is in like a trash compactor being compressed from no estrogen. It's the most insane thing. I've helped literally hundreds of thousands of men in the last 10 to 12 years by getting them off AIs, but it's still the legacy of testosterone use that most doctors who prescribe testosterone think that you have to block estrogen. There's this absurd obsession with high test and low estrogen. And again, let me just classify this. When people say I have high estrogen symptoms, by the way, when somebody tells you that they're estrogen dominant, do you know what that really means? Not enough testosterone. It means they're insulin resistant. There's no such thing as estrogen dominance. Do you realize that 80% of clinical people, men and women talk about people being estrogen dominant and have absolutely no fucking idea what they're saying. Insulin resistance is what is estrogen dominance. All the problems that people have that they report as estrogen mediated side effects, whether it's high estrogen symptoms, or as women say, I'm estrogen dominant, it's insulin resistance. It's too much visceral body fat. It's too much inflammation and inflammatory cascades from the visceral body fat. And those things are what cause the symptoms that people report as high estrogen or estrogen dominant, but there's no such thing.

Melanie Avalon
It's all made up. That's wild. Nobody's ever said that on this show before.

Jay Campbell
And I promised you the clinical experts in the world, which I'm not because I did not have a medical degree, although some people will claim that I am because I know as much as I do, but I've been trained by the best in the world, the people who actually understand the evidence and the clinical studies and the peer review about hormone optimization for both men and women, and there's no such thing as estrogen dominance. Estrogen dominance is insulin resistance. There's no such thing as high estrogen symptoms. High estrogen symptoms are insulin resistance. You think about all these people in our world, right? 70% Melanie, 70% of American adults over the age of 40 right now are obese. Obese. So when you have obesity, you have insulin resistance. So if you're a fat man or woman and you inject therapeutic hormones or take it in any way, I mean, hopefully you're injecting it, you will get inflammatory reaction or reactive response from the testosterone into your visceral fat, especially if you're injecting in your belly, which a lot of people do. And those symptoms class slash side effects that they experience are not high estrogen.

It's insulin resistance. And so this is what I attempt to do whenever I come on podcast and I have this beautiful person like you who lets me talk, expound on all these things because it's usually people don't want to talk about this stuff because they're like, what is he talking about? I've never heard of this. This is bullshit. I'm telling you what I'm telling you is all true. There's no such thing as high estrogen symptoms. There's no such thing as estrogen dominance. It's all due to insulin resistance. Insulin resistance is what causes inflammation. Inflammation is what leads to cellular degradation and cellular degradation causes disease. It's a simple thing.

Melanie Avalon
What was that? Can you have, because since there's different types of estrogen, can there be a more inflammatory ratio of the types of estrogen that you have?

Jay Campbell
Yes, because estrone, you've got estrone, you've got estradiol, you've got estradiol, you've got all these different forms of it, but at the end of the day, all of their down conversions and up conversions, mostly down conversions, it's all related to or mediated by the level of cellular inflammation a person has. So again, going back to what we talked about 20 minutes ago, if you wanna live long, be lean.

Because the leaner you are, the less inflammation you have.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah i'm really passionate about this topic as well because i'm all about like love yourself at every size and everything but i feel like it did a real like there's a big the service done when we got into this paradigm of health at every size because then it was like people had to if you feel like you had to accept. Having access wait are you weren't are you weren't accepting yourself for loving yourself for and it's like those are different things like loving yourself versus health or different no absolutely and by the way.

Jay Campbell
I mean, I'm very outspoken about this. That's a giant scam. You cannot be obese and be healthy. I'm sorry if that offends people, but that's absolutely insane. That's literally delusion. There is no if ands or buts.

That's like people that say there's more than male and female. That's not true according to the biology of human beings. So if you want to believe that, you want to make up a story, that's fine. Be my guest. It's a free country, free world. We have free will, but there are truths and there are falsehoods, and there is male and female biology.

Now, there are, what is it called when a person is a hermaphrodite, right? So you can find people that have both, but that's the same thing. It's still male and female. It's still XX, XY, and then a homogenization of it, right? I identify as a house cat or all this nonsense that people talk about that they get into. I mean, that is delusion. And again, I'm not here to argue with people or get mad at people, but a lot of people want to live in delusion. That's fine, but there's no person on this planet. And by the way, my mom was morbidly obese, and I'm very compassionate and very outspoken and very empathetic with people that have obesity in their family or they are obese or they have insulin resistance and all this, and I will do whatever I can to help people.

It pains me when I see people like that, but to think that you're healthy by being highly inflamed and having too much visceral body fat, that is absolute complete. It's a scam. I mean, it's a falsehood. There's nothing healthy about it.

Melanie Avalon
I just think it should, I think it's a really unhealthy narrative because it makes people feel like they have to exist in that state and if they want to change it, that's a bad thing, which is just doesn't make any sense to me.

And speaking of the identifying as men or women, I was actually thinking about that while you were talking about prescribing testosterone and such, like, so now, I mean, can you say that you identify as a man, like, could a woman say that she identifies as a man so she needs testosterone?

Jay Campbell
It's this is a great question. I'll go even deeper on this. So So what's happening? This is a great bonus question.

So what's happening in our society today? Is with the trans and the you know sexual identity confusion, whatever you want to call it is This is so I mean you kind of already nailed it We are now in a world where the chemical contamination The toxin load of our society is so high and again This is debatable melanie. I mean you could say that is it the result of first world, you know technological expansion or is it a tinfoil hat, you know conspiracy By the elites that run the world or whoever runs the world from behind the veil, you know I'm sure it's a hyperdimensional reality that we exist in but The bottom line is is like is it you know the byproduct or is it an overt conspiracy? my argument and where i'm going with this in a second is that it's a combination of both but The the sexual confusion the trans the the misidentification the lack of identification All of this is due to a lack of testosterone in utero 1000 million percent it can all be clinically proven. It can all be scientifically proven People are coming out of the womb today Without enough testosterone to understand what their biological functioning is. That's what is happening Okay, so do we blame them? No, we do not But at the same time we can't create a society that is like living in delusion that you know Again, people think they're cats or they're aliens from, you know, whatever planet The end of the day there's male and female biology in third density of human rate of the human level of whatever this is, you know and You are one of the two and like I said if you identify as both because you're a hermaphrodite that is a genetic abnormality But it's only those two things and so it's like If you realize that the only thing that separates from me and you Okay, is the amount of testosterone that we were exposed to in utero that You realize that males and females are really not that much different And so if you had way less exposure to testosterone to become a woman than I did as a male Then that's just the way it was, you know And everything else my our moms or our dads were exposed to you know When we were conceived and created and all that stuff, but like there's nothing that's changed other than now Melanie, it's just less testosterone And again, why is there less testosterone? There's less testosterone due to the birth control and the water supply, due to the plastics, the endocrine-disrupting chemicals, the glyphosate, the atrazine, the EMF, the blue light, the chemicals, the lead. I mean, I can go on and on and on. The shit they spray in our skies that we see. There are so many reasons that men and women have less testosterone coming out of the womb today. I mean, I think you probably have seen this.

Jay Campbell
I'm sure you've had people come on your show. The average man walking around on the street right now has 1 7th the testosterone of the World War II generation. 1 7th, so if you tested 100 men right now under the age of 30, anywhere in the United States, and I'll just say the first world, because it's not nearly as prevalent outside of the modern world, because you still have a more ancestral environment, you will literally find that probably 90% of them have a free testosterone that indicates a clinical deficiency, 90%. It's so bad, it's the greatest, it's actually bigger than any other crisis that we have on the planet right now.

Obesity is right there, but you gotta understand it's the chicken and egg question, right? Because what causes obesity? Hormone deficiency. Hormones that don't work is what causes people to get fatter, lazier, less energetic. So that's why I always tell a person, people ask me, what's the biggest myth about peptides, getting back to the peptide conversation, what do people have to do before they start taking peptides? And I always say, if you literally start using therapeutic peptides and you have a hormone deficiency, you're gonna get 50% of the peptide effect that somebody like me would use is hormonally optimized.

Melanie Avalon
Okay, are our women a similar stat for their testosterone?

Jay Campbell
women who are not hormonally optimized will not get the same effects as women that are hormonally optimized. And again, why is this?

Why is the human body a symphony orchestra, right? We have the endocrine system, which is our hormones. We have the thyroid, which is our temperature regulator, our master temperature gland, or heat production gland. And then we have our pancreas, which control the regulation and the secretion of insulin, right? And as we age, obviously, the remaining insulin sensitive is the most important thing we can do to maintain our health, in addition to being lean. But obviously, if you remain insulin sensitive, you're going to be ultimately de facto lean. But those three things are the primary movers, the foundational precepts, before a person looks into taking peptides or growth hormone or methylene blue or Metasred or any of these amazing, you know, call them biomedical wonder molecules or golden age agents are coming into the world right now, because again, you can't optimize something.

Melanie Avalon
that's broken actually question about that because i was thinking about this little bit of a contradiction or at least say perplexity because on the one hand like you're saying if you're optimized then you can get the optimal effect from you know the peptide or whatever whatever you may be doing and at the same time if you're not optimized it seems like you would have more potential to make change or see improvement yes

Jay Campbell
You can but just remember so so a good way for the audience to because it's a good question They're good comment the best way for the audience is to visualize this. So if a person is not hormonally optimized Let's say they're the average American. I love it.

Right the sad diet the standard American diet Let's go on the standard American person this sap And no calm the sap And sap you kind of got it right already, right and and they are they've sprained their ankle or they sprained their thought Let's just say they sprained their elbow and they're already inflamed. They're not energetically efficient because they're not trained They don't exercise. They're not lifting weights. They're not like you and me. They don't eat enough protein blah blah blah They're just the standard sap and they inject BPC 157 or TB 500 Will they get a reaction and a response that will improve healing? Yes, but because they're inflamed and their cellular networks are not firing like a healthy or hormonally optimized person They're gonna probably get one third to one fourth of the healing that the hormonally optimized person would work and again It's very common sense the hormonally optimized person has everything working And so if you give them a peptide that's like a healing peptide, you know It's gonna be like something on steroids because it's amplifying their cellular signals that are already healthy Versus somebody who isn't healthy who has nothing to amplify You're only gonna get like a small systemic effect from injecting locally at that spot You see I'm saying so so yes If someone has a lot of room to go and a lot of room to maneuver is obviously very poor health They could get an effect from some peptides again like a healing peptide the big picture big needle movers the mitochondrial optimizers the Neutropic the neuro, you know enhancers the stuff that improves growth hormone production Like most of those people are so broken metabolically and cellularly You know from a cascade standpoint that they're just gonna see a very small lift

Melanie Avalon
Okay, that completely makes sense.

Jay Campbell
explains it. And let me give you another one that's even better on this. Like why do heavy insulin resistant people love NAD plus because NAD plus turns the lights on.

Melanie Avalon
in their body. Okay. That makes sense.

I have a really quick question just while we're talking about BPC 157 because I think that's one that people are pretty familiar with. It's like you can say it and people might know what you're talking about because we talked about like how injecting peptides is the way to go and we can talk a little bit more about oral bioavailability or lack thereof, which it seems there seems to be a lack thereof in general, but we're going to talk about other things. But BPC 157, you mentioned the book, it's made in stomach acid and I know a lot of people take it orally. So logically it would seem like that would work if it's being created that way anyways.

Jay Campbell
It does. You said a lot of good things there to unpack. So oral peptides right now until the big changeover that's coming in the next, hopefully in the next... Well, I don't know when this is going to produce. I can tell you, actually. Okay, awesome. Tell me that. So for the record, obviously, today is June 5th, 2025. So four weeks or so from now, we're going to fundamentally change the peptide delivery game from an oral standpoint.

But to your question and to your comment and to your point, oral peptides, for the most part, are worthless unless they're targeting the microbiome, which is obviously the gut. So if they have stabilizing molecules, absorption-enhancing molecules, in addition to specific peptides that target the gut, intestinal fauna, the microbiome, upregulating acromancy of mucillus and all these other helpful pathogens that line the stomach lining, then you can do really a lot of stuff. In fact, we own two products or sell two products, is the best way to say it, called Biogut Pro. Biogut Pro is, without a doubt, this is no exaggeration the strongest oral peptide formulation on the planet. And again, it is designed for the gut. It has KPV, BPC-157, tributrin. It has so many amazing orally absorbable for the gut peptides. And so it's like one giant synergistic mix. And then we also have another one called Bioabsorb. Excuse me, not BioResorb. BioRestore. There's so many Bio's names. BioRestore is BPC-157, but in an arginine salt fashion. And it also has PEA, which is called palmittal ethylametate, and a couple other absorption enhancers. L-carnosine, and I forget the other stuff, sodium bicarbonate, and one other product. And we specifically designed that in that form. Again, it's called an arginine salt, because it will get into portal circulation from the small intestine and not get completely destroyed in the stomach by stomach acids and everything else that's going on down there. So when people ask me, Jay, what is an oral peptide's efficacy compared to like a subcutaneous or intramuscular injectable peptide? I always say it's literally 80 to 90 percent more efficacious and injectable, unless it's designed for the microbiome or the gut. And in that case, it's usually half as effective. So for people that will not inject, The oral forms that target gut function and motility and all that stuff are actually really good because and by the way this is also something important to understand if it's 50% efficacious that just means that you have to use two times as much okay so if you're taking six capsules which is the targeted dose for someone who's super inflamed in the microbiome someone who has SIBO someone who has dysbiosis someone who has Candida or yeast infection.

Jay Campbell
If you took six capsules of BioGut Pro you would be getting what would be equal to a shot of a high dose of all those peptides I shouldn't say a high dose but an intermediate dose of all those peptides and so that's why we designed that but again do not think that you're gonna take again oral BPC like ours biorestore if you have an elbow or a shoulder injury and think it's going to work even if you mega dose you see what I'm saying so a lot of people get confused so I'm very clear when I explain this that oral products up until the one we're going to talk about soon have will only target the small excuse me first pass it through the small intestine into the microbiome

Melanie Avalon
into your gut. And then, and to that point, and by the way, listeners, because I know can be a little bit overwhelming for people.

If you get Jay's book about peptides, just get it now, because he goes through all the different categories of things you can address and list the specific peptides. So you don't have to memorize or remember things. It's all, all in there, all these other peptides that, and when we're injecting them, how many are systemic versus local, how does that work?

Jay Campbell
remember from the beginning, injectable peptides is the highest impact delivery system. Depending on the peptide, and again, and this is in case of most that are injectable, you can inject them intramuscular. So anywhere on the body that is a muscle, like the shoulder, the triceps, the quads, the glutes, even your side, like down like the side of your belly, those are called the obliques, like into that area, you can inject there, or you can inject subcutaneously, which is obviously around the midsection, the navel, the belly button area. There's other places that you could technically call as subcutaneous, but that's like the primary place.

They're really equal. Now, when I say they're equal, there haven't been a lot of studies done, Melanie, that show the difference in efficacy between injecting intramuscular versus subcutaneous. I think as a 21-year peptide user like myself, I personally believe that if you inject, if you're a lean, let's just, let's go back. If you're a relatively lean person and you inject into the muscle, you'll probably feel something more than you would injecting into the fat. That's not to say that it's more efficient, but because your muscle is more vascular and has more nerve fiber bundles, you'll feel something more effectively. So like, for example, if you're injecting BPC 157, you know, into a traumatized arm versus injecting it into the belly, you're if you inject it, obviously, locally into the arm, which is in a muscle bed or a muscle tissue, you're going to feel pain relief and systemic inflammation, or I shouldn't say systemic, but localized inflammation suppression faster by injecting it there than if you do in the belly, but you'll still get it. If you inject it in the belly, it'll just take longer. Does that make sense?

Melanie Avalon
Yes, how does it know where to go?

Jay Campbell
go. Again, the beauty of peptides, I mean, again, their fractionated proteins, their organic signaling molecules, they're normally naturally found. Like with BPC, as you know, it's found with gastric juice. So it just knows what to do once it's in the body.

I mean, there's no question that injecting it locally as close to the site or the origin of the injury is always going to be best, but you'll still get a systemic effect if you inject somewhere close. So, for example, because people will say, you know, I sprained my knee, I can't inject into my knee bone. Well, actually you could. And if this was a video podcast, I could show you, but you just pinch the skin like you can do it right now, pinch the skin above your kneecap and you inject into the skin right there. Right? So it'd be like the same thing if it's your arm, like pinch some skin on your arm, inject into where the skin, you know, is what it lacks and just inject into that. So there's a lot of ways to do this. I personally think that over time, if you inject subcutaneously versus injecting intramuscularly, that the difference is going to be very nominal. The only exception is, of course, if you have a severe acute injury and you want to inject locally at the origin, if you can, there's obviously some parts on your body that you couldn't do that. But if you can, you'll probably get faster healing by injecting locally than you would if you inject, you know, subcutaneously further away.

Melanie Avalon
Is it an agilist too or would it be similar to I've had Christian Japro on the show a few times from stem regen talking all about stem cells and he was talking about how just email me oh yeah i love him and i'm stephanie so much but we were talking about how like with stem cells if you're trying to address an injury that's like an old injury not a new injury that. Essentially stimulating that in injury can help with it signaling to the stem cells for some cells to go there so like if somebody has an old injury.

And then they and they want to inject peptides for it would there be any benefit to I don't remember how he was talking about doing this like working up. Nothing like to punch yourself but no no no no i.

Jay Campbell
You know what he's saying, he's saying, so the answer is yes, to inject locally into the origin of the injury, even if it's a latent injury that doesn't really truly give you pain anymore. Just talk about stem cells and exosomes and all those things, all those things are great. My opinion is that you save exosomes and stem cell treatments for when you're seriously acutely injured. I do think it's important that PRP, it's all in there, there's even now plasmapheresis, there's all sorts of amazing things coming into the marketplace. I do think it's important that people do understand though, because I like to say on this, if you are bone on bone in the spine. Yes, which is my mom. Yes, and you do not have any introvertible space. You cannot use stem cells or PRP or plasmapheresis or anything, because again, it's not going to do anything when you're bone on bone.

And there's a lot of people out there, let's just call them straight up scammers, who tell people, oh, come down to Costa Rica or come down to Panama or come down to Mexico or whatever third world Latin country and get your stems and you won't feel any pain for three years. That's a complete lie. Do not, if you are bone on bone, do any of those things. Now that's not to say that it might provide some localized relief for a short amount of time. And that would obviously be in the supporting soft tissue around the bone on bone issue, but it's not going to heal you. It will not. And I've heard, I mean, I've had so many people who've come to me and said, yeah, I got taken to the cleaners. And I was like, damn, man, I wish you would have listened to me or paid attention. Cause I'm very, very clear in telling people that bone on bone in the spine, unfortunately there is nothing. Well, I shouldn't say nothing because there now is a peptide that we sell, but we can't keep it in stock because of course, it sells out in five seconds. You ready for this? We had 144 vials in stock last Tuesday. It sold out in three minutes and 20 seconds. It's called Cartolax. Does it build cartilage? Yes. So, so I don't want to say yes because it's all anecdotal. We don't have any clinical studies. It's a Russian bioregulator. It is an injectable bioregulator, which is the newest class, but people are literally injecting it in serious cartilage damage issues and they're all raving. Chris Gethin has raved about cartilage. There's another one called Seagamiller. He says he used both of those when he damaged his elbow earlier last year. He couldn't train for a long time. Him and I just did a big seminar together in Tulum and he told everybody his story about it. Add he says i think it's a game changer so we're starting to get more more cuz it's only been in the marketplace for two months but we're starting to get more more people trickle in about this products and oh my god my shoulder and a lot of old elderly people who have not had it been able to find anything to provide relief so again i don't wanna make any claims.

Jay Campbell
But so far anecdotally experientially from people who use car locks they seem to be getting some sort of a cartilage regenerative effect. Which as you know yes if it's true it turns out to be real that it's gonna be a game changer.

I can absolute game changer because so far nothing you know has been shown to regenerate cartilage i mean again. BBC TV 500 stems extra songs plasma for recess these things will strengthen connective tissue around these weakened areas but they won't provide healing. You know and that's what these people are really searching for because let's face it if they are bone on bone in their spine they feel pain a lot.

Melanie Avalon
Yeah, my mom's had that for as long as I can remember and I've always heard there's nothing nothing that can be done because

Jay Campbell
Just at least they're not lying to you because I mean so many of the stem cell people tell those poor people that if you come down to me and spend $25,000, you won't have pain for three years. I mean, you have no idea the stories that I've heard. Wow.

Melanie Avalon
So, a quick question about this cartilage-related peptide. Since peptides are things that we naturally have in our body, well, actually, that's a question.

Are all the peptides that people take things that humans naturally have in their body or some not?

Jay Campbell
Some are not. So, I mean, again, to think about it, peptides are synthesized, but they are biosignaling molecules. So the majority of them are found in the human body or if not in humans, they're in bovine or porcine. So again, cows and pigs, which share a very close genetic tree to us in a lot of ways, which is a whole rabbit hole of itself.

But the reality is, is that, to your question, Cardelax is a Russian bioregulator. It's an injectable form. A great regulator. So, but most of the bioregulators that most people know about are oral. But now, since I guess the bioregulator wall has crumbled, it used to be that you could not get them in the United States because Dr. Cavinson just had all these Russian patent walls that were not to be infringed upon and so they weren't bringing in. But once he died in December, and by the way, he died later that year after my book was released and stuff. I was actually supposed to meet him in February of 2024 and he died in December. But interestingly enough, ever since he died, the ability, let's just call it the ubiquitous nature now of bioregulators is pretty much everywhere, which is obviously a great benefit to the world because people can get them.

We are actually, my company now is actually the largest purchaser of bioregulators in the world. So, we are buying and they still come from, well, we get them from Latvia. That's where they come from. But they're manufactured. Who knows where they're manufactured? We think they're manufactured in Amsterdam. And then they're shipped to Latvia and then Latvia ships them globally to anybody who wants to buy them. But they really are, honestly, Melanie, they really are the future. I mean, peptides are awesome. But imagine signaling molecules like bioregulators that are organ and biological systems specific. So, what I mean by that is they're oral capsules. So, obviously, there's no barrier of entry. Anybody will swallow them. And they literally go to work on the exact specific organ system or biological system. For example, there's a peptide, excuse me, a bioregulator for the prostate. It's called libidone. And as a man, as you know, gets older, his prostate increases in size. It's called BPH, benign prostate hypertrophy. And you could literally take four of these libidone capsules a day for like 20 days in a row.

Jay Campbell
Or you could take six in a day for 10 days in a row and do it twice a year. And it shrinks the male prostate, zero side effects.

No issues it literally goes to work shrinking the mail prostate i've had hundreds of people who used it in the last year who read your send me emails or send me testimonials and this is the most amazing thing i've ever done you know i've got all this allopathic treatments and i don't know how much you know about prostate cancer for men and dealing with it but it's barbaric the shit that goes on in that realm is insane i tell every man do not have a radical prostatectomy which is the removal of your prostate die with prostate cancer it's not going to kill you if you live to seventy eight it's eighty percent likelihood that you're going to have a mild form of prostate cancer that's just what happens with the male prostate as you get older so do not get you know go into the doctors or the allopathic you know system and let them perform voodoo three and removal and all this horrific like i said it's medieval it's barbaric i mean i have so many stories you know assess what it is if you have again a stage one or stage two as you know there's so many alternative treatment forms now you can use antiparasitic you know with than bad as all and you can use obviously i did all these other amazing antiparasitic attacks of cancer that is so much less invasive than the bullshit that they do i know this is kind of a rabbit hole but imagine so many other bioregulators that target specific issues like there's an ovary bioregulator there's a brain bioregual multiple brain bioregulators multiple i bioregulators thymus gland bioregulators kidneys liver it's incredible they're literally it's a very big disease it's a very big disease it's a very big disease it's a very big disease i'm not sure what the

Melanie Avalon
incredible. So the, and wait, in the Cardelax was the bioregulator. So it's,

Jay Campbell
So so the car locks right now is injectable now from what we've been told though, there is an oral version of it, but we don't have access to it because it's still like kind of locked up in Russia, but all these things will be coming. There's no doubt that and again, because of who we are and where we're at, we're going to have access to these before anybody else does.

Melanie Avalon
So like it could, so like my mom, for example, it could be injected, doesn't necessarily have to be directly into the spine. So you would pinch the spine.

Jay Campbell
skin on her low back, which I guarantee is she has lack skin there.

What is she in her 60s or 70s?

How old is she 60s?

Yeah, so you would just pinch the skin and the low back and you just put a 31 or 32 gauge insulin needle.

And by the way, we haven't even talked about it on this podcast, because it's so advanced.

But people are using pens now.

So you can use a medical grade pen with a four mm, you know, four micron needle size.

And by the way, that's not even as long as a thumbnail.

It's microscopic.

So you can jab anybody with those and they don't feel it.

It's like Star Trek shit.

Oh, my goodness.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

So my wife and I my wife and I use pens now.

I haven't used I have not injected myself subcutaneously with like an insulin syringe for close to a year.

I have pens for all my peptides.

Melanie Avalon
Whoa, and you can wait so I don't know about these pens you buy that you buy the pen separately and then you put it in or you have to.

Jay Campbell
Yes, and obviously I have videos demonstrating how you do it, but it's a total game changer. At the Dave Asprey conference last week and our thing, they turned away 150 people from our room, dude. I should have been on the main stage. It was insane, but we showed everybody what they look like, and they were all like, oh my God.

So, I mean, it really is a revolutionary change for peptide users to use a pen, but once you use a pen, Melanie, my wife injects her face with GHK, CU, BBC, TV 500, Snap 8. Yeah, you just write like on the edge of your cheekbone and you get restoration, thick or thicker. What do you call it? Collagen, it beefs up the collagen, gives you more elasticity. It's amazing. It's a game changer.

Melanie Avalon
changer. Is there one that's a good alternative to Botox?

Jay Campbell
That would be, if you put Snap 8 with GHK-CU, BBC TV 500, and there's another one now, I think it's called PEGMEF Peptide, if you put all those in a pen, that would be about as close as you can get. And by the way, so you're the first person to know this, no one knows this, I'm breaking it on the melody, Avalon podcast right now.

We have two products that are coming out that are going to, in addition to the ones that you and I are gonna talk about in a minute, it's a hair regrowth product and a facial rejuvenation product that will revolutionize both hair and skin health in the world. The hair product will grow hair on a bald head and the face product will be stronger than Botox. Now these products are gonna be super expensive because just to make them with all of the, imagine them as like kitchen sink peptide by regular blends. So it'll be like all of the strongest things that we know to man, you know, I've been like in the peptide hair regrowth space for a long time. So I've been researching this for six years. So like it's taken me six years to actually bring this like formulation to the marketplace. It's still not there yet. Like we're still waiting, we have two manufacturers and they're like now battling it out between like what type of bottle to put it in because we can't put it in a high-end glass formula, last bottle because the peptides under freezing conditions might expand and they'll break the fucking glass. So yeah, so we gotta, you know, we're probably gonna use it in a very high-end acrylic polymer. So it doesn't matter what expands and how cold. And by the way, you know, you really have to think about these in product formulation these days because as you know, we're living in crazy climates. You can't send these type of things to cold weather climates and not expect there to be damage because it literally the peptides will expand under extreme conditions.

Melanie Avalon
cold. Yeah, that's why the other day, it's funny, I thought it was a mistake and I feel silly now.

I ordered some cold press oils and they came with a hand warmer in them and I was like, why does this oil have a hand warmer? And I emailed the company, I was like, it's supposed to be cool. I don't want to do... And they're like, no, that was on purpose. So I guess it was shipped from somewhere frozen, like cold.

Jay Campbell
Yeah, I mean I learned a tough lesson. It's a long story.

I won't share it But I mean it cost us a lot of money back in 2019 We created a brand new patented hair product. It was called oxano and then this was version two and we were like so proud of it because we had just gotten promoted on Ben's Ben Greenfield's podcast about it and He sold it He like pre-sold the whole thing out and literally We sold out of our entire batch in two days and over the next three months. All I got was emails From people showing the broken glass and the purple the purple leaked out Stuff in their packaging and they were literally like send us our money back. It almost it almost put us under We almost went completely under it was also during kovat.

It was in during 2021. So we couldn't reach we couldn't restock Because you know, we're the whole member of the Chinese the barrel issues and stuff the the floating container Cabocles back then But those those were dark days man Waking up in the morning to literally emails with purple shit leaking out saying hey, bro. I love you, but you need to refund me We charge the bottle each product each bottle was 299 bucks It was a nightmare but so just so you know and again to tell you because you're the first person that knows is I Don't know what the hair product is gonna cost but my guess is it's gonna cost a thousand bucks And it'll probably last depending on the length of your hair and how bad your hair loss is by the way It'll work for women and men. It'll be amazing.

You know, it'll strengthen any women's like it'll strengthen the tensile strength of your follicle and by the way, it'll darken you to your natural root, too So whatever your natural color is it'll get darker and it doesn't matter your age. That's how powerful this is But my guess is it's gonna be 45 days in bald men and or bald people which mostly are men and Probably 90 days and most users they don't be a literally a thousand dollars But I mean as you know, I mean for people that care about their hair, they'll

Melanie Avalon
And once it starts growing after that time, do you have to keep it you have to get another order?

Jay Campbell
So it'll it'll it'll so for most women that are suffering from hormonal hair loss, they'll be good after 90 days We'll probably end up making a maintenance air You know a shampoo for 50 bucks or some shit like that That'll probably like strength maintain the strength of the tent of the follicle and maybe it'll be a little bit more expensive than that I I've already told our one of my partners and my formulator That I don't want to make people spend more than 50 bucks for the shampoo and the shampoo will be a 90 day supply for sure But it'll just depend I mean obviously men that have androgenic alopecia and they're always losing hair They're gonna have to use it forever. Well this

Melanie Avalon
shampoo, because a brand just sent me a topical peptide for your hair. Well, the shampoo like does that work? Oh, no, it's proprietary.

Jay Campbell
Oh, yeah, one skin. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, I mean, their shit's good. So, I'm sure it's good.

I mean, believe me, there'll be other people that'll be bringing it out, but nobody's going to come out with this product because it's too expensive to manufacture. And they also don't know the secret ingredients. I mean, we're... My company, it was called Aceter, A-S-E-I-R, when we sold in 2022, we were the first peptide hair regrowth product that got patented in the world. So, we really know the formulation space as far as like what you can and can't do. And so, like I said, it's been six years that I've been working on this product in the background. So, I mean, I know that this product will be an absolute game changer, but like I said, it's going to be expensive.

But I mean, most men, as you know, they'll go to Turkey and spend seven or $8,000 for a hair transplant. So, I mean, if you spend $1,000 and regrow your hair and then just keep it at a maintenance dose, it's still going to probably be cheaper from a standpoint of like year round, it's going to cost you like $2,000 or $2,500 versus going to get a painful deal.

And then people that get... I don't know if you know this, but people that get hair transplants, they still lose their hair. It still goes out. They still have premature shedding, androgenic alopecia if they're genetically predisposed. So, it's a constant... It's a zero-sum game because you're always battling loss.

So, if you can take something that's just topical... And by the way, this product will be enhanced with other things, right? Like you can wear... You can use like a red lights.

Melanie Avalon
goal cap. Yeah, I was wondering. So I was thinking about that. Like, is it synergistic or Oh, her

Jay Campbell
And by the way, you probably don't know this because most people don't know this but I'm gonna ask you the question if you get This right, dude. I mean, I'm gonna have to give you some money.

I'm gonna have to give you some free free shit What causes what causes hair loss? I don't

Melanie Avalon
know, I know there's like the different cycles of the hair growth. Yep, that's part of it. And then when you're in the loss phase, it's just like part of the cycle. So does that? I don't know.

Jay Campbell
that part. There's a million. So you're on the right path. There's a million reasons for hair loss, but why we lose hair is due to blood flow restriction to the scalp. Oh, okay. So how about this? If you buy a traction device and hang upside down for 15 to 20 minutes a night, you will literally better hair growth.

Melanie Avalon
Why would some people just not have that circulation to their head so it's a million.

Jay Campbell
reasons, like literally hair loss is so multi-factual, like exposure to, you know, heavy metals, toxins, sunlight, chemicals, stress, you know, hormone depletion. I mean, there's thousands of reasons why hair is lost.

I mean, most women's hair loss is due to anxiety and cortisol production. Like even women's hormonal hair loss is really anxiety and cortisol production. Why do 85% of the autoimmune diagnoses go to women? Because women are the main stressor. Women are the creative hearth, the super fire, the nuclear reactor of the family, and they worry about everything. You know, I talk about my wife and I think about how when she lays her bed at night, she's thinking about feeding the dogs in the morning, getting the girls off to school, you know, pleasing her husband, you know, doing this, getting her work done, blah, blah, blah. I mean, you guys think about so many things. And again, it's because you have this amazing skill to multitask, you know, where the dude is just like, oh, you know, going to bed, I can sleep. So but I mean, like women, they stress so much that they increase cortisol production. And then that leads to some sort of whacked out autoimmune condition or disease or diagnosis. And that's what ends up causing it. So almost all women's hair loss is stress, chronic stress, chronic sleep deprivation.

Sure, there's a hormonal factor to especially women, they're not hormonally optimized. You know, and by the way, you give a woman estrogen and progesterone without giving them testosterone, hair loss is certain to follow. Because now you basically you've underrun the thyroid gland, you know, so I didn't say this, I'll just say this really quick. So when you optimize a person's hormones, you also have to optimize thyroid and you have to optimize the pancreas. Again, you got to optimize insulin, and you got to bump thyroid production. Because if you optimize the endocrine system, which obviously in men is and women is progesterone and estrogen and testosterone, you can't leave the thyroid behind, right? So it's like you've got to give them a slight bump of like, you know, porcine or desiccated thyroid, again, just a small amount is all they need. Some people need more, but most people just need a small amount. But if you don't do that, and you just look for, you know, testosterone, and by the way, same thing with the pancreas, you know, dihydroberber and metformin, and I think a combination of both is as optimal, you'll get sluggish insulin. So again, you got to look at them as like the holy triune, and you got to have all three legs of the chair, you got to look at all three of them. So you got to optimize all three of those whenever you're doing it. And that's, you know, ultimately what happens when you see women who have hair loss when they get older is like, again, their doctors not giving them testosterone, they're not giving them desiccated thyroid, and they're probably giving them progesterone industrial. And before you know it, they got

Melanie Avalon
Well, so this episode is going to come out like mid-September.

Jay Campbell
September. We got to talk about the strips then before it's over. So the hair loss.

Melanie Avalon
Do you have any idea when it might be coming out? It might be.

Jay Campbell
Right now we're just waiting on costs for both. Mm-hmm, yeah.

Melanie Avalon
Wow, that's exciting. Oh my goodness. And then so, but definitely by that time, your other thing will be out, right? Yes.

Jay Campbell
of the strips are four weeks away.

Melanie Avalon
Okay, perfect. So what are these strips?

Jay Campbell
Okay, so amazing woman by the name of Sarah Morgan reached out to me and one of my other business partners, Hunter William, shout out to Hunter about six weeks ago and said she works for a company called InstaMed and they're based out of Utah or their productions in Utah. She lives in Colorado and she said they delivered this or they developed this revolutionary new patented oral peptide strip technology and that they wanted to meet with us because they were like, we love you guys. You guys have done so much for the peptide using world. We just think it's a natural to let you guys launch this to the world.

First off, I didn't know her from Adam and whenever somebody comes to me, Melanie, with oral stuff, I know so much about this stuff. I instantly like to say, oh, whatever, it's not going to do shit. So I was kind of reluctant, but Hunter is a way nicer person than me and way less experienced. So he was like, oh, no, bro, we got to give him a shot. Let's have a call with him. So anyway, we get on a call and honestly, Sarah is amazing. Like she captivated me and there are very few people that can captivate me. I mean, she's a very attractive woman, but she's an effing genius.

Like she was just blowing my mind with like efficacy studies and seven years it's taken us and I'm like seven years. What? So anyway, long story short, she blows us away. She says, you know, at the end of this conversation, which was really only five weeks ago, she says, yeah, we're ready to send them to you guys now. And we're like, wait a minute, you've developed them. And she's like, yeah. And I'm like, you gotta be fucking kidding me. Like, which ones are they? And she's so I'm holding him in my hands right now. So CJC one, two, nine, five PT, one 41, which by the way, this is going to be a revolutionary leap in sexual performance for men and women, thymus and alpha one, which as you know, is like the super power immuno modulating peptide, which anyone can take BPC one 57. And of course, drum roll, GHK, see, right? So all these five and, and I'm like, okay, are you gonna send them to us? And she goes, no better. I'm gonna, I'm gonna meet you guys at the Dave Asprey conference and you guys can release these to the world that they asked me.

What? So anyway, true story. She comes, we meet her. She's amazing. She has, she gets us 5,000 of these. We paid for them. Of course, she sends us 5,000 of these. We're giving them out to people at the booth. We're literally giving them away for free. Oh my goodness. Why did I not come in your booth? Because we were on the fifth floor. I mean, dude, by the way, we got to say, I mean, Dave's our friend, but dude, that thing was so poorly laid out. I mean, I think, I think most of the people that were there didn't even know there were two levels.

Melanie Avalon
it was really hard to find the booths we had a lot of meetings and we struggled

Jay Campbell
I was on his podcast on that Tuesday and it was awesome. We crushed it.

We even talked about these on the podcast. But I mean, it was just it was an amazing conference. It was probably the best conference I've ever been to. It was insane. There were so many people, but I think it was just a venue. You know, you gotta have one level.

Melanie Avalon
I did like, did you stay in the hotel? Yeah. I did like how there wasn't a big walk, you know, like you just.

Jay Campbell
That was amazing. But it also killed the elevators though. You couldn't get on the elevators. I mean, I was trying to do podcasts and I was sitting on the elevator for 20 minutes, just trying to get from the top floor to the bottom floor.

But anyway, long story short, so she comes to the booth, she hung out with us two days. We gave away these things. No, by the way, just so you know, because again, I'm going to show me, don't tell me, I still was somewhat doubtful of these. I'm still like, eh, I'm familiar with buccal, whatever you want to call it. Because they've tried to do buccal delivery systems and testosterone for a long time. And it just never really works. It works okay for women. But again, you can't really get that much through small intestine for men to make it work. So I was just, I was still not in total denial, but I was just kind of like, eh, it's a gimmick. But then Melanie, the people that were there started coming back. And all you had to do was look at their faces. And you were like, oh my God. And then my business partner and his girlfriend, well, they're actually married now. They came back and they texted. Well, wife texted my wife and my hunter texted me. He's like, bro, the PT 141, holy effing. So like anybody who's taken PT 141 that's listened to this podcast, especially women, they know that it's like one out of two gets nausea and can't take it. So they stop the nausea. So imagine Melanie taking a wafer of the number one most powerful sexual and libido enhancing drug on the planet and putting it on your tongue. And then 15 minutes later, it's freaky time.

Melanie Avalon
How long does it last?

Jay Campbell
Feeling so it's a micro dose of it right now They also put in oxytocin into it. So it's insane So and then there's something else and I always forget how to pronounce it.

It's like another uh, molecular enhancer stabilizer But it's amazing and they so they're a super micro dose of this so they're like look you start low and go slow You know for women and she did it for women especially Dude, this is what she texted me. You'll love this She'll get me permission to say this She texted me this earlier today and she said She goes I said I this is what I texted her. I said, okay So now I know the pt 141 works and she goes ha ha hell. Yes, it does I almost drowned my husband in a hot tub with those strips

Melanie Avalon
Bye-bye!

Jay Campbell
So seriously hunter and his wife abuse it now full disclosure as of right now I have one strip and I have not used it with my wife We've been so busy since we got back to the asprey conference So we have not even had a chance to do anything. We've got kids dogs all that But i'm really looking forward to it, but to your question It's so low That you probably as a woman are going to want to do two strips And as a man, it's going to probably be two or three strips But it could be one strip per person and just so you know before you ask because I know where your mind's going There's 20 strips in a box So this is like yeah, this is gonna be way better So this is what I want you to think and I want your audience to think about this now So what are the biggest the biggest hindrances and drawbacks to peptides are a calculations the math the reconstitution, you know putting water in a vial And then having to configure what your dosage is versus milligrams versus micrograms, you know using a peptide calculator all this nonsense, right?

Now let's compound it right? We're traveling. We're a successful businessman or woman. We're traveling across the world We're traveling across the country. We got to bring our peptides in our fucking coolers or in our carry-ons You know, we have to refrigerate them. We have to get to a refrigerator We have to get to a cooler blah blah blah dude this solves all that now imagine this getting on a plane And putting in a thymus and alpha strip in your mouth before the flying takes off And then landing and putting another one in your mouth when you get off boom

Melanie Avalon
super immunity. Yeah, I really want that one. Oh, my goodness. Oh, my goodness. That's crazy. These things are insane.

Jay Campbell
By the way, I haven't even told you this yet, so I'm going to blow your brain. She messaged me in that same text after, and she said, yep, we're four to six weeks out from having GLP2 and GLP3. Yeah, imagine that. This is a billion-dollar business without a doubt.

The questions are, and I'm sure you're thinking this, is like, how is pharma going to look at this? Are they going to come after us? Are they going to try to shut us down because we don't have FDA approval? Supposedly, from what we understand from our attorney and, of course, from their attorneys, is because it's oral, they don't give a shit. It's just basically going to be considered a food supplement. Now, could that change? Could they be like, oh, no, you're not going to take away our business from GLPs or from PT-141? Because people don't realize the PT-141 is an FDA-approved peptide. It is called brenalaminotide. It's super outrageously expensive. They rip people off to buy it through pharma sources when, obviously, you can get it from any research place for way cheaper. We don't know.

The future is still open, but again, if we all keep believing in the Baja movement and believe in RFK and all the things that are happening, we think that we're going to have access to this. I mean, look, they're not going to delete peptides. They're not putting the genie back in the bottle, but they may limit our use or try to restrict our use or whatever, but as I always say, and I've been saying this for a decade since I started doing podcasts, where there is a will, there's a way. When there is a supply, there is a demand. It's as simple as that. You can't kill it. You can't block it. You might restrict it. You might make it tougher, but as you know, that didn't work for the prohibition movement back in the days when they tried to block alcohol.

How's it going to work for peptides? Honestly, I think these are, like I said, you'll see our website in the next day or two. We're going to have a banner at the top saying, coming soon. This is how crazy it is, Melanie. The biohack yourself, people are doing huge promos for it right now. By the way, we're not paying them. They're just doing it because they were like, holy shit. They had their whole crew up there and they were videoing the whole thing, but they did a promo yesterday. I think they did a promo today because my Instagram notifications have been going off the hook, but I had 262 messages when I woke up this morning from people that said, how do I buy this?

When is it available? Just one promo. So you already know, I think I told you this, if I didn't I'll say it now, 80% of the public does not inject themselves. They will not inject themselves. Again, fear of needles is too much. So imagine the market that's actually out there for something that can go on the tongue that let's just say theoretically is only 60% as efficacious as an injection. I presume that it'll probably, some of them will be 75, but let's just say on average all of them are going to level out at 60%. Dude, they're all going to do it because remember what I told you, it just takes two. What's the name of the market?

Melanie Avalon
with a sex one that makes you PT 141. This is kind of a nuanced question.

But okay, it's like alcohol, for example, makes you can make you really attracted to people that you actually shouldn't be with. I know where you're going with this. Yeah. So I'm wondering when a person uses a peptide to naturally just become a, you know, a fertile, you know, sexually turned on person, are you going to be attracted to the people that you should be with?

Jay Campbell
Everybody no no no no no so one hundred percent it's improves pair bonding it improves obviously oxytocin the oxytocin really the oxytocin and it will only enhance it so it's not gonna make you just like see some you know.

Ruthless alpha male guy or vice versa and say i wanna fuck it's not it's not it's not gonna do that so it's not gonna lower your inhibitions like i like i like alcohol as a depressant will do no.

But it will one hundred percent stimulate the clitoris it makes the penis harder thicker last way longer i mean i'm telling you dude it's not there's nothing like it i mean if you ever spoken to anybody that's used PT one.

Melanie Avalon
I don't think so. I mean, I know that's not true. I know I have I just haven't talked about it with

Jay Campbell
Yeah, so I got you. So so hey first time for everything But so it makes my wife sick and honestly in 50% of the women that use it If you if you if you use too much It's toast right because like you might have a raging erection want to have sex and your wife is literally killed over dead Like nauseous not vomiting but maybe dry heaving.

I mean it really is that right? So this drug meaning this strip has alleviated that issue completely Wow. Okay Yes, like I said, this is a complete game changer like we we ordered a healthy supply and and honestly She's only producing for us right now in the whole world like she's definitely gonna have I would have said assume deals with Compounders because obviously, you know, she wants to sell to research and to compound the world and and who how people price is up to them She doesn't care. She has her wholesale cost that she charges it, you know based on volume and anybody can it's a free world Right free market, but she's already we were actually now concerned in just the four days that we're it's been actually five days Since we released it days because it was Wednesday. Oh shit. God. It's a week dude. Holy shit. It's a week It's eight days. Well, it's technically seven days because people didn't really find out about until Thursday But so far the reaction online has been insane Like we we've been talking like to ourselves that we had a Strategy meeting yesterday. We were like fuck. We should double the dose. I mean doubled our order But she she wouldn't she you know, she's she's also being you know Cautious right now too because we have this, you know, it's the same old shit with the e-commerce world You got to wait on the boxes You know You got to make sure that the holographic seals like cuz they're gonna make strip foils like right now the one she made for us Are just stickers and you know, I'll send you a screenshot of what it looks like You give me your cell phone after and we'll text each other and I'll show you what it looks But you just peel the sticker back and you pull out the wafer But you know that the ones we're gonna be selling are gonna have like a foil and it'll have like our bio longevity labs logo across the side of it and you'll just perforate the foil and pull the strip out and I mean They're these are a game changer.

I mean the only thing I don't know is I don't really know You know if say the GH agonist injectable peptides that everyone knows and loves like Ipamorella or CJC or any of those are gonna work as well. Now. I do know the CJC 1 2 9 5 works really well, I took two To go to bed the first night that we got these when we met her and I slept like a baby I mean I I was like, oh Wow, I mean so in by the way, you haven't even asked this yet, but I'll bring it up. Yes, you can stack So so she's gonna create like super blends right like sleep blends Like brain blends like insane stuff You know, like you want to you want to raise your IQ 10-point blend For four hours or eight hours or something like that, you know, so like there's no limit on these I mean this technology.

Jay Campbell
I mean i'm sure this is probably a trillion dollar technology. Honestly from a patent standpoint. Wow Yeah, it's a game changer. I mean it's a game changer.

Now look if you Listen to people who debate the the efficacious aspect of oral peptides They're gonna come out and they're gonna say jay campbell's full of shit. Sarah morgan's full of shit. This is not true We've looked at oral but what they don't understand is this is different than oral. This is not oral absorption This is what called an insta-release technology and it goes into the mucosal membranes of the wall of the mouth So it's like literally imagine it like this if you are injecting into the roof of your mouth That's what's happening. So it's completely different than swallowing a capsule getting it into you know The small intestine the large intestine going through the liver, you know passing through hepatic function all that stuff is it's bypassed This is literally like an injection into the roof of the mouth or or even think of like the sides of your cheek And remember the mucosal membranes in the sides of our cheek. Why do you think doctors swab our cheeks? It's heavy capillaries tons of blood flow So this works really well, this is an absolute 100% game-changing technology and it's crazy That it took her and her team to invent this when they had buccal technology in the literally late 90s They were attempting to do hormones with buccals I mean, I wrote about buccals in my book in 2014 And it was like well doesn't work doesn't work But so I mean i'm so thankful her and honestly, I know you're going to meet her because I honestly you should bring her on Your podcast immediately.

She's she's a game changer woman. She's so smart. She's just like you dude. She's a biohacker You know been doing all this stuff doing the things. I mean, I mean she blew me away I mean, I really honestly was like wow

Melanie Avalon
This is incredible. One question that might, I think, given the answer, this might make people feel a little bit more comfortable if they're nervous about regulation and legality and things like that.

So you mentioned prohibition earlier, and I think a little unknown fact that people might not know is that in prohibition, the only thing that was actually illegal was selling alcohol, not consuming alcohol, which is interesting. That's the same thing now. Is it the same with all this stuff? Even if it's banned, is that just the selling of it compared to the consuming? Literally. So I'll take you one deeper.

Jay Campbell
So you're gonna love this. This is I told you this podcast was gonna be amazing. I've told you stuff I've never told anybody.

This is so deep people are gonna be like holy shit But so this is what's happening right now in the peptide world And I and again unless you're an insider you don't know this but I'll share it to the public cuz I'm just an authentic person So Eli Lilly owns the patents for terzapatide and retrutide which are stage two GLPs which most of your audience knows them as Monjaro or zep bound and retrutide is the stage 3 GLP Which still is not yet FDA approved, but it's the patent is owned by Lilly. It will be FDA approved by the way It is the strongest most effective drug in the history of mankind.

We didn't talk about that today, but trust me it is I've been using it for a year and a half. It is a game changer for Metabolic health it eliminates food noise It changes people's physiques unlike anything before it it enhances nutrient partitioning it improves insulin sensitivity I can go on it's insane It will be the world's top-selling drug immediately as soon as it's approved But what Lilly is doing and by the way, Lilly is the reptilians They I mean, I don't they have more money than you and I could even imagine We couldn't even calculate it if we sat down together and tried to figure out the biggest numbers. They have more than that They have a 1 billion dollar legal defense fund and what they are doing right now is they're going after anyone who sells GLP peptides whether it's compound pharmacies or research companies As in their mind No one else should have the right to sell them because they paid for the patent now Let me explain something to you and how retarded this is and how insane this is and shows you what kind of megalomaniacs For three years from 2022 to 2025 actually was end of 2021 till like February of this year the FDA ruled Because Lilly could not manufacture their peptides their GLP 1 and GLP. I'm excuse me The other GLP 2 peptides fast enough that they gave compound pharmacies the right to make them in what is called Emergency use declaration. So what that means is they couldn't keep up with the demand So they gave the compounders the right to make it so that they could fill this fill the demand right fill the supply and Literally, that was the legal aspect of it.

And that was the rights of anybody Lily Melanie has gone after all of them and sued them and tried to shut them down I mean you cannot imagine now when you understand how crazy this is You also have to realize that Lily is BlackRock When you start looking at who runs the world and who controls all the money, I mean, dude, BlackRock is like the front pocket of Lilly or Lilly is the back pocket of BlackRock. They're going after all the credit card processors that are processing the transactions for the compound pharmacies and the research companies. Think about that. In the last six weeks, they have literally canceled our credit card processing.

Jay Campbell
We don't even sell their products. That's how big of a cartel they are.

They can shut down anyone. They can shut anybody down. They can't say that you're breaking the law, but they can say, oh, we don't want them selling, you know, we have so much money and so much power and so much influence. We don't want them selling any injectable peptides or anything that's injectable GLPs. So shut down their credit card processing. And, dude, they got that much power and pull. They end up shutting down companies' credit card processing. So now the whole industry right now is like scrambling to make sure they have backup credit card processors. It's insane. That's the world that we live in right now.

Melanie Avalon
I'm gonna have to ask my dad about this. He's pretty high up in the credit card processing world

Jay Campbell
owner piece. He absolutely 100% knows. Just ask him about research, chemical companies, and compound pharmacies right now, and Lily, and he'll know instantly. Yeah, he'll know instantly.

It's crazy. I mean, honestly, it's a game. It's an absolute game. No one's breaking the law. The law was, hey, you could manufacture these under the emergency use declarations that were created by the FDA. They couldn't fulfill the demand. And by the way, think about that, Noni. That's how big the peptide using public is for just GLP once last year. Lily sold over $4 billion in just Monjaro, $4 billion. Wow.

Melanie Avalon
Does this next generation one, the one that you really like, does it have any of the issues of like a zimpic and such that people? Zero.

Jay Campbell
I mean, I mean there's always so so we'll end the show on this there's always side effects with any peptides when people don't know What they're doing and I'll explain this The average person who uses a GLP one, which would be you know, we go V Which is some agatide to to stage two, which is what we're talking about now the Lily drug Which is true zapatite manjaro zep pound to stage three, which is also Lily which is read a true tide If you don't have your foundational principles dialed in and the foundational I have actually have a 10 I have a 10 commandments of GLP use but we won't get out We'll just give the foundational principles and that's number one. These are very powerful agents If you don't eat enough protein to maintain, you know skeletal muscle mass, you will lose muscle mass I don't care number two if you're not hormonally optimized and you start one of these You better have your world super dialed in from a nutrition standpoint from a training standpoint from a cardio standpoint from a sleep standpoint or a You're gonna lose muscle also and by the way, most people are not hormonally optimized as we've already indicated on this podcast So they lose muscle and then number three is and this is the biggest scariest saddest one Most of them are working with doctors who have no idea what they're doing, right?

The pharma process with GLPs is start high and go higher Right, because that's how you line the manufacturer's pocket. That's how you line the doctor's pocket That's how you learn the man the pharmaceutical reps pocket in my world as I've said many times on this show We start low and we go slow That's why when you use a GLP you always micro dose. So we avoid side effects.

We avoid receptor desensitization Or receptor attenuation, which is the same thing. It's when the obviously the tissues become desensitized and we also Start at a low dosage and a micro dosage so that we can obviously afford it and assess our unique individual tolerance to it So you never ever blow out your receptors. You never ever started a super high dose I mean think about this these people that are starting Manjar are not Manjaro But some aglutide would go be at five or six or ten or fifteen milligrams a week. That's insane Melanie That's overwhelming the receptors that's causing all the side effects that you hear about in the marketplace Like we go the neck neck or face or butt or ass or any of this nonsense that people that lose muscle the damage or thyroid Their hair falls out. Some of these people have you know, what do you call it gallbladder issues? I mean, it's all insane it's an insane world because they're not dosed or Appropriately or they're not taught meaning the patient by the doctor what to do, right?

Jay Campbell
And so all these negative side effects that people you've heard about that, you know Celebrity doctors and celebrity guru, you know influencers are talked about they're right But it has nothing to do with the drug it has all to do with the dosing You know just like you know, Tim Ferriss said the difference between a pill and a poison is the dosage When people take these things irresponsibly without having the foundational precepts yes you're gonna run into problems and the problems suck. But here's the thing right if you're a fat person and you take manjaro or you take what go be. You don't know what you're doing but it works so profoundly that you see pet me you see your scale dropping your pants sizes dropping your dress size dropping you just keep doing it. Because all these people are doing is not eating as much anymore. Not changing their lifestyle they're not eating better they're just eating less but as I say after four weeks to six weeks now there's metabolic hell to pay the thyroid's damage they've lost muscle they've run out of money I mean imagine going from five to ten to fifteen to twenty to twenty five milligrams.

I mean you're literally spending fifteen hundred dollars a week for one shot. And that's what's happening to these people it's insane what is happening in the industry for all these people that are misusing these drugs when they are absolutely in the studies the most profound life altering drugs ever I mean all the smart influencers who really understand what's going on with GLPs are saying the same thing as I'm saying these are the greatest drugs in the history of mankind but they have to be clinically used correctly. You know you've got people like Brian artists out there who's literally claiming that it's the Gila monster and that the reptilians are secretly infiltrating us with Gila venom in the GLPs if he understood anything about drugs which he doesn't almost all drugs in the world come from insects they come from reptilians millions. It's absolutely retarded how dumb these people are you know and Brian artists you know is one of the good guys seemingly because he's gone off and told people about the covid vaccine and how demonic and detrimental it is but I don't know it just blows me away when I see the nonsense and I hear the nonsense when I know how amazing these drugs are and look again to finish I've been using red a true tide for close to a year in a micro dose I you know I take a month off I use a super super low dose anyway so I never really you know saturate my receptors Melanie I've got my blood my labs done three times in the year that I've been on it and I have the greatest biomarkers that I've ever had in my life I had my HDL cholesterol go up 18 points 18 points I have seen my cholesterol drop and I always had low cholesterol and low triglycerides I have like 17 triglycerides my cholesterol is like a hundred and thirteen. You cannot believe people will be like, yeah, that's low cholesterol. That's not healthy. It's like, dude, come and look at my biomarkers. Look at my APO, my APOB. I mean, I have the most amazing biomarker.

Jay Campbell
So like, again, the proof is in the pudding. If you do this stuff right and you use it in clinically precise dosages with, you know, time off, it's the most amazing drug ever.

I mean, I feel like I can literally keep myself at 8% body fat year round until I die and I can pretty much eat whatever the fuck I want. Now, I don't eat like shit. You know what I mean? But if I want to eat a couple slices of pizza on the weekend, I can and I still stay shredded. And you can do that now with all these amazing biomedical technologies, you know, like peptides, like small molecules, like all these things, you just have to know how to do it right.

Melanie Avalon
I feel like my eyes have been opened. Oh my goodness, this is life-changing information. Thank you so much.

Jay Campbell
Thank you that you just did a two and a half hour podcast with me. This is amazing.

Melanie Avalon
This was like one of the best. I cannot wait for people to hear this and I've got it. I should have started this yesterday. I'm like, I gotta get on this.

Wow. Okay. So again, I know listeners are probably, hopefully not overwhelmed, but this was a lot of information. So the book, like your book has so much information, like these supplements, like where should people go for the best information to stay current, your website, like what's best.

Jay Campbell
Yeah, no, for sure. And again, thank you so much. Like I told you, I really knew, I kind of manifested it when I saw your notes that this was going to be a game changer. I think this is going to really help the public. You asked amazing questions. I covered things that I don't normally cover. I felt very calm with you, very like, it was a very safe area and I really appreciate you. So you were amazing as an interviewer, jcamble.com is my website. There's a ton of free information there. It's now in the top five, you know, peptide related information sites online. There's just so much free information there. I also have a domain that I use for anybody that listens to me on podcasts. It's jcamble.com forward slash free books. And on that domain, you can get a copy of all eight of my books. Only five have been international bus sellers, but there's eight amazing books there. They're all downloadable free PDF. So all you have to do is go there and you can get any of my books. There's a lot of stuff coming. I have a book coming on GLPs that is going to be a game changer. I'm hopeful that it'll be out before fourth quarter of this year. It'll be just like the peptide book that you read. So you already know, you know, I think one of my gifts is taking very esoteric and arcane concepts and making them relatable to average people. So I'm pretty sure that the GLP one book is going to be like that. We're going to really teach people how to use GLPs. And I think you know, Melanie, like right now, GLPs are the biggest selling drug in the world. So if we can teach people how to use them clinically, you know, in the context of health and longevity, it's going to be a game changer. And unfortunately, there hasn't been anything out there that's really done that, you know, in my opinion, effectively. And then of course, any of you got any of your listening audience can find me on social media at jcamble333. And people always say what is 333? And 333 really is the angel number. It's the connection between master teachers in spirit and mind body. So I've had that 333 connected to my name for a very long time. But as you know, this is a interesting world that we live in. And I am heavily, heavily shadow banned and suppressed. So it's hard if I if I have and I do have an amazing team that puts out amazing social media, but you're not going to find it because they block everything. It's very difficult to find my information on instagram or x or youtube on some how i have like couple hundred thousand followers i think between everything but it's just very difficult almost anyone who follows me gets unfollowed. I need you know they let me know and stuff like that but i also have a. I think it's very important a private membership group that i've cultivated for five years since coded during two thousand twenty it's got close to seven hundred people in it now and honestly it is the who's who.

Jay Campbell
Of like super leading guru biohacker so if you're somebody that listen to this podcast and is completely overwhelmed is like jay campbell's insane i have no idea about anything you just said. join that group because everyone in that group started off like you and meaning the listener who's confused and now has like you know what i can say biohacked their best life and it's just an increase like a hall of records, I mean if you go in there and ask a question you'll get 100 answers in five minutes.

It's not read it by any stretch and by the way melody if you want it would be an honor for me I will give you a complete and total free ride in there and put you in there there's tons of influencers already in there. But just message me and i'll put you in that group, but I mean it'll blow your mind, I mean anything peptide biohacking I mean there it's the best people in the world.

Melanie Avalon
in that group. Oh my goodness, thank you so much. Yes, I would love to. Love to.

Jay Campbell
Yeah, I definitely want to I definitely want to put you in that good. There's so many there's probably 230 I think as last count functional medicine doctors and clinical people in the group and everybody shares we have no it's not a troll group. So if anybody if anybody comes in and does anything stupid, they get deleted. There's no, you know, I mean, I mean, you know, if you if you ask an innocent question, it's bad, you know, you'll get scolded by one of the moderators, but there's nobody coming in there scamming people or trying to solicit services.

It's just a free group for him.

Melanie Avalon
information sourcing. Amazing. Thank you. Oh my goodness. I did.

Jay Campbell
It's got a free group. I shouldn't have said that.

It's $99 a month and it's $249 a quarter. Obviously, we keep it that way so we don't get trolls and low vibration, but it's amazing.

That's my proudest thing in this world is I've cultivated a group of true leaders. I'm going to message you with a couple of people in my customer service department and I'm going to have them give you a free group.

Melanie Avalon
ride. Thank you so much. Oh, my goodness. I have just so much gratitude for everything that you're doing this whole conversation. Like, huh, you are doing what is so needed, which is like you said earlier, you have a talent of taking all of this information and the science and what actually works and then distilling it down and making it, you know, accessible and implementable for people and inspiring. So, wow, thank you.

We need to have you on if you're down on the intermittent fasting podcast. And then we we could talk about all the stuff like stubborn fat and fasting and. Yes, yeah.

Jay Campbell
Yes. And by the way, just so you know, you probably have heard recently about the sugar diet. So Mark Bell is a good friend of mine. We actually did a huge podcast yesterday. I'll send you a link to that because I want you to watch that.

But we're developing FGF21, which is fibroblast growth factor 21, and it is literally a chemical agent that is produced by, I don't know what gland in the body. It's a master metabolic switch that when you take high levels of fruit sugar, it rips through fat. So it's like, if you haven't heard of the sugar diet, it's like becoming like a mainstream fad thing right now, but most people don't know how to do it right. But we're creating, and bio-longevity labs will sell it, the first, it's basically an exogenous peptide that if you inject it into stubborn fat areas, it will obliterate the stubborn fat, and it will obliterate the stubborn fat in like probably 24 hours. So I'll send you the video of us talking last night to you in my email to you, and you should definitely watch through it, but so I'm going to introduce you to Sarah Morgan because I think that's somebody you should have on the podcast right away because she'll blow minds.

Melanie Avalon
beyond anything I could have hoped for. It was incredible. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. And actually the last question that I ask every single guest on this show, and it's because I'm really obsessed with mindset and vibration and all the things. So what is something that you're grateful

Jay Campbell
So I am grateful for the opportunity to wake up every single day knowing that I am an infinite energetic being who is completely in control of my thoughts, my actions, and all of my thoughts become things. So never ever be a negative person.

Be positive, spread love, spread peace, and always, always be a service to others being.

Melanie Avalon
I love it so much, you are the best. Oh my goodness, I'm just so happy right now.

So thank you listeners, friends. We'll put all the information in the show notes and I'm just so excited about all the future things.

Jay Campbell
So thank you. Thank you so much, Melanie. It was an amazing podcast. I'm grateful. Have a great day.

Melanie Avalon
You too. Thanks Jay. Bye.

Thank you so much for listening to the Melanie Avalon biohacking podcast. For more information and resources, you can check out my book, What Win Wine, as well as my supplement line, Avalon X. Please visit MelanieAvalon.com to learn more about today's guests and always feel free to contact me at contact at MelanieAvalon.com and always remember, you got this.